2D Projective Complex Space, Spin

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of quantum states in the context of qubits, specifically addressing the implications of phase factors and the projective nature of the state space in quantum mechanics. Participants explore the effects of operations on qubits, the significance of relative phases, and the implications of these concepts in experimental scenarios.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that while states |0⟩ and -|0⟩ are considered equivalent in terms of probabilities predicted by the Born rule, they are not algebraically the same.
  • Others argue that the difference between |0⟩ and -|0⟩ becomes significant in superposition states, as demonstrated by orthogonality in specific superpositions.
  • A participant raises a scenario involving two electrons in the same state, questioning whether applying a magnetic field to one electron to rotate its state to -|0⟩ would yield detectable differences in subsequent experiments.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of applying phase factors in quantum operations, with some suggesting that unconditional application of phase factors may render certain distinctions undetectable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the significance of phase factors and the detectability of state differences in specific experimental setups. No consensus is reached regarding the implications of these factors on the equivalence of quantum states.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexities involved in determining the effects of phase factors and the conditions under which certain distinctions between states may or may not be observable. The discussion reflects a range of assumptions and interpretations regarding quantum mechanics.

msumm21
Messages
247
Reaction score
28
Just reviewing some QM again and I think I'm forgetting something basic. Just consider a qubit with basis {0, 1}. On the one hand I thought 0 and -0 are NOT the same state as demonstrated in interference experiments, but on the other hand the literature seems to say the state space is projective 2D complex Hilbert space and that cS=S for any state S and complex scalar c.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The difference between ##+\left| 0 \right\rangle## and ##-\left| 0 \right\rangle## matters when the qubit is in superposition. For example, ##\frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left| 1 \right\rangle + \frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left| 0 \right\rangle## is orthogonal to ##\frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left| 1 \right\rangle - \frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left| 0 \right\rangle##.

The phase of individual states also matters in the context of operations, where the relative phase with other possible outputs is relevant. A 180 degree rotation around the X axis of the bloch sphere sends ##\left| 0 \right\rangle## to ##\left| 1 \right\rangle## and ##\left| 1 \right\rangle## to ##\left| 0 \right\rangle##. If you instead send ##\left| 1 \right\rangle## to ##-\left| 0 \right\rangle##, you're rotating around the Y axis.

(I used to think that adding a global phase factor to an operation had no effect. This is technically true... until I modified said operation to be controlled by whether or not another qubit was on, so that phase factor only applied in some cases and was suddenly a relative phase factor making my circuit not work.)
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: dextercioby
msumm21 said:
[...] the literature seems to say the state space is projective 2D complex Hilbert space and that cS=S for any state S and complex scalar c.
Wether a system is in state |a> or in state c|a> is undecideable because the Born rule predicts the same probabilities for both. This is the sense in which the states can be considered to be "the same". This doesn't mean that they are algebraically the same.
 
So if we take two electrons both in the same state 0 then put one in a uniform magnetic field (oriented orthogonal to the direction of the spin) long enough to rotate the state to -0 (half the time required for full state rotation) there's no subsequent experiment we can do afterwards to determine that this system state is different from the case in which neither was in the magnetic field? Was Strilanc saying that we only make these distinctions when analyzing a single electron evolving through a system e.g. the experiment shown at the start of this:http://www-inst.eecs.berkeley.edu/~cs191/fa08/lectures/lecture14_fa08.pdf where the shift to -0 definitely made a difference in that context.
 
msumm21 said:
So if we take two electrons both in the same state 0 then put one in a uniform magnetic field (oriented orthogonal to the direction of the spin) long enough to rotate the state to -0 (half the time required for full state rotation) there's no subsequent experiment we can do afterwards to determine that this system state is different from the case in which neither was in the magnetic field? Was Strilanc saying that we only make these distinctions when analyzing a single electron evolving through a system e.g. the experiment shown at the start of this:http://www-inst.eecs.berkeley.edu/~cs191/fa08/lectures/lecture14_fa08.pdf where the shift to -0 definitely made a difference in that context.

If the electron's path was in superposition, so only one branch went through the magnetic field, then you could tell when recombining the paths (I have no idea if that's easy to do experimentally).

But if you unconditionally apply the phase factor in all possible branches, then no it's not detectable.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: msumm21

Similar threads

  • · Replies 61 ·
3
Replies
61
Views
6K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K