4-acceleration in a circular orbit around a black hole

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of 4-acceleration in a circular orbit around a black hole, specifically within the context of general relativity. Participants are examining the implications of geodesic motion and the conditions under which the 4-acceleration may be zero or non-zero.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between the 4-velocity and 4-acceleration, questioning the assumptions made about the orbital radius and the conditions for geodesic motion. There is discussion about the implications of using propulsion to maintain an orbit and how that affects the calculations.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the nature of geodesics and questioning the assumptions regarding the relationship between angular velocity and radius. Some guidance has been offered regarding the implications of non-geodesic motion, but no consensus has been reached on the calculations presented.

Contextual Notes

There is confusion regarding the parameters used in the problem, particularly the distinction between the Schwarzschild radius and the arbitrary radial coordinate. Participants are also addressing potential misinterpretations of the equations used in the calculations.

Thales Castro
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Homework Statement
A rocked describes a circular orbit around a black hole with angular velocity $\Omega$ (measured by a static observer at infinity) and Schwarzschild radius $r=R$. Calculate the 4-acceleration felt by the rocket.
Relevant Equations
Schwarzschild metric:
$$
ds^{2} = -\left( 1 - \frac{2M}{r} \right) + \frac{1}{1-\frac{2M}{r}} dr^{2} + r^{2}d\Omega^{2}
$$

Kepler law for GR:
$$
\Omega^{2} = \frac{M}{r^{3}}
$$

Christoffel symbols:
$$
\Gamma ^{\alpha}_{\mu \nu} = \frac{1}{2}g^{\alpha \beta}\left( \partial_{\mu}g_{\nu \beta} + \partial_{\nu}g_{\mu \beta} - \partial_{\beta}g_{\mu \nu}\right )
$$

4-acceleration:
$$
a^{\mu} = u^{\alpha} \nabla_{\alpha} u^{\mu} = \frac{d u^{\mu}}{d\tau} + \Gamma^{\mu}_{\alpha \beta}u^{\alpha}u^{\beta}
$$
In a circular orbit, the 4-velocity is given by (I have already normalized it)
$$
u^{\mu} = \left(1-\frac{3M}{r}\right)^{-\frac{1}{2}} (1,0,0,\Omega)
$$Now, taking the covariant derivative, the only non vanishing term will be

$$
a^{1} = \Gamma^{1}_{00}u^{0}u^{0} + \Gamma^{1}_{33}u^{3}u^{3}
$$

Evaluating the Christoffel symbols, we have:

$$
\Gamma^{1}_{00} = \frac{M}{r^2}\left( 1 -\frac{2M}{r} \right )
$$

$$
\Gamma^{1}_{33} = -r\left( 1 -\frac{2M}{r} \right )
$$

By putting these values in the equation for a^1, I get

$$
a^{1} = \left( 1 - \frac{2M}{R} \right )\left(1 - \frac{3M}{R} \right )^{-1} \left[\frac{M}{R^{2}} - R\Omega^{2} \right ] = 0
$$

Now, I don't see why the acceleration should be zero in this problem, but still I can't find what I have done wrong in my calculations. Can anyone help me? Thanks in advance.
 
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Thales Castro said:
Now, I don't see why the acceleration should be zero in this problem, ...
The ship is in free-fall. Therefore, it follows a time-like geodesic in spacetime. The equation for geodesic motion tells you something about the four acceleration.

Alternately, imagine going to a "local inertial frame" of the ship. What is the four-acceleration of the ship in this frame? From this, what can you conclude about the four-acceleration of the ship in any other frame of reference (such as the frame using the Schwarzschild coordinates)?
 
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TSny said:
The ship is in free-fall. Therefore, it follows a time-like geodesic in spacetime. The equation for geodesic motion tells you something about the four acceleration.

Alternately, imagine going to a "local inertial frame" of the ship. What is the four-acceleration of the ship in this frame? From this, what can you conclude about the four-acceleration of the ship in any other frame of reference (such as the frame using the Schwarzschild coordinates)?

Thanks for the reply. That makes sense. One thing that I discussed with my colleagues later is that the relation between Omega and R is not necessarily the one I gave in the text. The rocket could be using his propulsion to keep himself at the "wrong" speed in his orbit, and in this his worldline would not be a geodesic.
 
Are you assuming that it is orbiting at the Schwarzschild radius R? Or is the orbital radius r a parameter? In this case, the acceleration is not zero.
 
Thales Castro said:
... the relation between Omega and R is not necessarily the one I gave in the text. The rocket could be using his propulsion to keep himself at the "wrong" speed in his orbit, and in this his worldline would not be a geodesic.
Oh. In that case, you can't assume M = Ω2r3 so the 4-acceleration would be nonzero.

In the last line of your first post, you seem to have let r = R. Did you mean to do that? I think @phyzguy was wondering about that also.
 
Last edited:
phyzguy said:
Are you assuming that it is orbiting at the Schwarzschild radius R? Or is the orbital radius r a parameter? In this case, the acceleration is not zero.
TSny said:
Oh. In that case, you can't assume M = Ω2r3 so the 4-acceleration would be nonzero.

In the last line of your first post, you seem to have let r = R. Did you meant to do that? I think @phyzguy was wondering about that also.
Yeah, R is an arbitrary fixed radial coordinate (not necessarily the Schwarzschild radius 2M) in which the circular orbit takes place. r is the radial coordinate (in the same sense I would have an x coordinate and a fixed point x_{0})
 
Thales Castro said:
Yeah, R is an arbitrary fixed radial coordinate (not necessarily the Schwarzschild radius 2M) in which the circular orbit takes place. r is the radial coordinate (in the same sense I would have an x coordinate and a fixed point x_{0})
OK. It was just a little confusing since the problem statement uses R for the Schwarzschild radius.
 
Thales Castro said:
$$
a^{1} = \left( 1 - \frac{2M}{R} \right )\left(1 - \frac{3M}{R} \right )^{-1} \left[\frac{M}{R^{2}} - R\Omega^{2} \right ] = 0
$$

According to what I calculate, the
$$\left(1 - \frac{3M}{R} \right )^{-1}$$
factor in the acceleration is not correct for non-geodesic uniform circular motion.

The 4-velocity is
$$u =\left(\frac{dt}{d\tau},0,0,\frac{d \phi}{d\tau} \right) = \frac{dt}{d\tau} \left(1,0,0,\Omega \right) ,$$
where ##\Omega = d \phi /dt## is constant.

Use the normalization of the 4-velocity to eliminate ##dt / d \tau##.
 
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