A couple of questions about photons and superposition..

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of photons as they pass through polarization filters, specifically addressing the concepts of superposition and definite polarization states. Participants explore the implications of these concepts in the context of quantum mechanics and the mathematical formalism associated with polarization states.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that after passing through the first filter, the photon is in a state with a "100% chance of passing through a horizontally oriented filter," suggesting it is not in a superposition of horizontal and vertical polarization, but rather in a superposition along other axes.
  • Another participant emphasizes that the photon never has a definite polarization in any direction, clarifying that "100% chance of passing through a horizontally oriented filter" does not equate to being definitely polarized along the horizontal axis.
  • It is proposed that whether a state is considered in superposition can depend on the choice of basis states, indicating a level of subjectivity in defining superposition.
  • Participants engage in a light-hearted exchange regarding the complexity of the discussion and the implications of diving deeper into the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There is no clear consensus on the definitions of superposition and definite polarization, with multiple competing views presented. Participants express differing interpretations of what constitutes a definite polarization state and the implications of superposition based on the chosen basis.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the nuances in the definitions of polarization states and superposition, which may depend on the mathematical formalism employed and the specific context of the discussion.

Karagoz
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There are two polarization filters, A and B.

Photon.png


Polarization filter A has angle of 0° and B has an angle of 30°.

A photon is in superposition, so it doesn't have a definite polarization axis. The likelihood it's passing through a filter is depend on the difference between angle of the polarization filter A and angle of the polarization axis of photon.

But let's say the photon did pass through the filter A, and the photon's axis is now parallell with the filter A's axis (and X axis).

After passing through filter A, is that photon still in a superposition, or does this photon now have a definite polarization axis, or is it still in superposition?

The likelihood P of that photon passing through polarization filter B, is it P = cos^2(30°) = 0.75 ?
 

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Karagoz said:
After passing through filter A, is that photon still in a superposition, or does this photon now have a definite polarization axis, or is it still in superposition?
After it passes through the first filter, it is in the state "100% chance of passing through a horizontally oriented filter". That state is not a superposition of horizontally polarized and vertically polarized. However, it is a superposition of polarization along other axes. In particular, it is equal to ##\frac{\sqrt{3}}{2}|30\rangle+\frac{1}{2}|120\rangle## where ##|30\rangle## is the state "100% chance of passing through a filter at 30 degrees from horizontal" and ##|120\rangle## is the state "100% chance of passing through a filter perpendicular to 30 degrees". Apply the Born rule to that superposition and you will see that the photon does in fact have a .75 probability of passing the 30-degree filter.

(Note that I have carefully avoided saying that the photon has a definite polarization in any direction. It never does - "100% chance of passing through a horizontally oriented filter" is not the same thing as "definitely polarized on a horizontal axis")
 
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Nugatory said:
(Note that I have carefully avoided saying that the photon has a definite polarization in any direction. It never does - "100% chance of passing through a horizontally oriented filter" is not the same thing as "definitely polarized on a horizontal axis")
Unless that's what you define "definite polarisation" as... Just sayin'.
 
Whether something is in superposition depends on your choice of basis states. A state could be in superposition in one set of basis states and not in another.
 
Derek P said:
Unless that's what you define "definite polarisation" as... Just sayin'.
Fair enough, but do you want to take a B-level thread into that swamp? :)
The mathematical formalism says what I said and no more, so that's as much as I'm going to say in this thread.
 
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Nugatory said:
Fair enough, but do you want to take a B-level thread into that swamp? :)

Nooooo... We need to drain that swamp. :smile:

PS As I go to "like" your post, I realize you are at 3500 likes already. Impressive.
 
DrChinese said:
3500 likes
3,502 actually :biggrin:
 

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