A Series of Exoplanets in Our Solar System

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Discussion Overview

This discussion explores a hypothetical scenario involving an alternate universe where Earth and its neighboring planets have different physical characteristics. Participants examine the implications of these changes on Earth's nightscape and Milankovitch cycles, alongside references to real-life discoveries of exoplanets.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes an alternate universe with modified characteristics of Earth and its planets, proposing questions about the visual and cyclical effects on Earth.
  • Another participant mentions the discovery of a Super-Earth beyond the Kuiper Belt, suggesting a connection to the discussion but not addressing the original questions.
  • A later reply emphasizes the complexity of Earth's ice age cycles, attributing significant influence to the axial tilt and suggesting that additional factors may be involved in the Pleistocene cycles.
  • Participants express uncertainty regarding the calculations needed to estimate ice age cycles in the proposed alternate universe, with one seeking clarification on the implications of the modified Moon.
  • There is a debate over the credibility of YouTube as a source for scientific discoveries, with some participants questioning its reliability.
  • One participant disputes the claim about the discovery of a Super-Earth, arguing that it is based on suspicion rather than confirmed evidence and raises concerns about the classification of such a body.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the existence and classification of the Super-Earth, as well as differing opinions on the reliability of YouTube as a source of scientific information. The discussion on the Milankovitch cycles remains unresolved, with no consensus on the factors influencing ice age cycles in the alternate scenario.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the complexity of the Milankovitch cycles and the need for specific calculations related to the modified characteristics of the planets, indicating that assumptions and definitions are crucial to the discussion.

JohnWDailey
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In this alternate universe, Earth is the same as back home--8,000 miles wide, 25,000 around, six sextillion tons, orbiting a G-type main-sequence star from a distance of 93 million miles. But here, the similarities end.

MOON
DIAMETER--3,273 miles
MASS--0.025x that of Earth
DISTANCE FROM EARTH--475,000 miles

MERCURY (based on 55 Cancri e)
DIAMETER--2x that of Earth
MASS--8x that of Earth
DISTANCE FROM THE SUN--1.4 million miles

VENUS (based on Kepler-69c)
DIAMETER--1.75x that of Earth
MASS--5.5x that of Earth
DISTANCE FROM THE SUN--67.24 million miles

MARS (based on Gliese 1214 b)
DIAMETER--2.7x that of Earth
MASS--7x that of Earth
DISTANCE FROM THE SUN--141.6 million miles

Jupiter, Saturn and Uranus are identical in diameter, mass and distance from the sun to back home. Neptune, however, does not exist.

There are two important factors to consider that most scientists believe are connected to the orbital mechanics of our solar system.

The first and more obvious is the asteroid belt, leftovers of rock, ice and metal that survived the mighty pull of the gas giants.

There is a second, more complicated factor connected to the solar system — the Milankovitch cycles, named after Serbian geophysicist/astronomer Milutin Milankovitch. He proposed that the ice ages Earth had been experiencing for the past two-and-a-half million years were made possible by three basic factors:

  • Eccentricity (Orbital shape) — In an average ice age, the shape of the Earth’s orbit varied from 0.000055 to 0.0679 with the mean being 0.0019 over a cycle of 100,000 years.
  • Obliquity (Axial tilt) — In an average ice age, the earth’s axis varies from 22.1 degrees to 24.5 degrees over a period of 41,000 years.
  • Precession (Axis of rotation in relation to fixed stars) — Today’s North Star is Polaris, but won’t be the case forever — its supposed duration is 26,000 years.

Using the details provided above, what will Earth's nightscape look like? And how will these changes affect Earth's Milankovitch cycles?
 
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I have news for you: they've (in real life) found a Super-Earth beyond the Kuiper Belt.
 
RyderP said:
I have news for you: they've (in real life) found a Super-Earth beyond the Kuiper Belt.
That doesn't answer the question.
 
JohnWDailey said:
And how will these changes affect Earth's Milankovitch cycles?

We don't even understand the ice age cycles of our Earth. The most important factor seems to be the 40 ky cycle of the axis tilt. A low tilt causes the polar caps to grow and high tilts let them melt. The 40 ky ice age cycles of the early Pleistocene can be explained with this single factor only. In the late Pleistocene there must have been at least one addional factor because several of the melting opportunities during the maximum tilt have been missed, resulting in 80 ky or 120 ky cycles (with an average of 100).

To estimate the length of an ice age cycle on your Earth you would need to calculate the duration of the wobbling of the Earth axis with the data od the modified Moon. Everything else (how strong the ice ages are, how many wobbling cycles they last or if there are ice ages at all) is your artistic licence.
 
DrStupid said:
To estimate the length of an ice age cycle on your Earth you would need to calculate the duration of the wobbling of the Earth axis with the data od the modified Moon.
Meaning?
 
RyderP said:
I have news for you: they've (in real life) found a Super-Earth beyond the Kuiper Belt.
Care to provide a link concerning this discovery of a new large planet in the solar system?
 
JohnWDailey said:
Meaning?

I have no idea. I just know the result for Earth as we know it but I didn't found a corresponding calculation.
 
rootone said:
Care to provide a link concerning this discovery of a new large planet in the solar system?
Look it up on YouTube under 7 top scientific discoveries.
 
RyderP said:
Look it up on YouTube under 7 top scientific discoveries.

I'm curious if YouTube counts as ligitimate reference.
 
  • #10
YouTube is not a reputable source of scientific discoveries.
You can find accounts of UFO abductions, ghosts, and miracle cures for cancer on YouTube.
 
  • #11
RyderP said:
I have news for you: they've (in real life) found a Super-Earth beyond the Kuiper Belt.

No they haven't. They just have a good suspicion of where one might be. Also, due to "Clearing the neighborhood", we might never know if we can call it a planet or not.
 

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