Ampere's law to find free current in a wire

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around applying Ampere's law to determine the free current in a wire. Participants are exploring the mathematical formulation and integral calculations involved in the problem.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the need to perform an integral related to Ampere's law and question the dimensional correctness of the given equations. There are attempts to clarify the components of the integral, particularly the surface vector and its magnitude.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on how to approach the integral and have pointed out potential errors in the original equations. There is an ongoing exploration of different methods to simplify the integral, with suggestions to utilize the symmetry of the problem.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of confusion regarding the dimensions of certain parameters and the setup of the integral. Participants are also considering the implications of azimuthal symmetry in their calculations.

Benlaww
Messages
18
Reaction score
3
Homework Statement
An long straight wire (can be assumed infinite) with a circular cross-section of radius R is lying along the z axis and it has
an internal H~ field given by:

H = (j_0/r) ((1/a^2)sin(ar)-(r/a)cos(ar)) φˆ

where r is the radial distance from the centre of the circular conductor, φˆ is the azimuthal unit
vector, J0 is a constant current density, and a=π/(2R).

Find an expression for the total free current
in the conductor, and give its direction.
Relevant Equations
Ampere's law
∫ H.dl = ∫ j_f .dS = I_f
∇ x H = j_f
I'm not sure how to actually solve this?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Do the integral. What is ##d\vec S##?
Your equation
H = j_0/r ((1/a^2)sin(ar)-(r/a)cos(ar)) φˆ is dimensionally incorrect. Parameter a apparently has dimensions of inverse length. You can't have (1/a^2)sin(ar)-(r/a)cos(ar). Please fix it.
 
Last edited:
I know that I have to do the integral but it's actually doing the integral which I'm struggling with. This is the equation that I was given.
 

Attachments

  • H.JPG
    H.JPG
    2.9 KB · Views: 178
You can see that the equation is dimensionally incorrect. You have to ask the person who expects you to solve the problem about it, but let's set it aside for the time being. If you know you have to do the integral, you need to assemble its components. First and foremost is ##d\vec S##. How would you write that as a vector? In other words, what is its direction and what is its magnitude?
 
Last edited:
So dS is the small surface vector which is the area on the end of the wire (πR^2) pointing normally outward in the z direction?
 
You got the direction right but not the magnitude. See here how to write the magnitude.
 
so dS = r dr dθ Z
as there's no terms in θ, after canceling terms becomes:

(j_0/a^2) ∫ sin(ar) dr - (j_0/a) ∫ rcos(ar) dr
 
I think you are doing the hard way by calculating a surface integral. In the OP you write something that inspires for a clever shortcut, $$\oint \mathbf{H}\cdot d\mathbf{l}=I_{\text{free_enclosed}}$$

This integral will be much easier to find since the given H has azimuthal symmetry and is in the ##\hat\phi## direction, so just choose as loop of integration any circle of radius r.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: kuruman and Steve4Physics
So would it be
∫ H . 2πr dr with bounds 0 and R?
 
  • #10
Benlaww said:
So would it be
∫ H . 2πr dr with bounds 0 and R?
Nope, dl of post #8 and your dr are not the same, the integral of H around a circle of radius r, will essentially be $$H\cdot 2\pi r$$ that is just a multiplication because H has azimuthal symmetry and is in the ##\hat\phi## direction.
 
  • #11
So H.2πr = I _ free enclosed? Does r stay as r or does it go to R?
 
  • #12
Benlaww said:
So H.2πr = I _ free enclosed? Does r stay as r or does it go to R?
After you multiply you can put r=R to find the total enclosed current.
 
  • #13
Thank you so much! This is a great help!
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Delta2

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 30 ·
2
Replies
30
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K