Approaches towards quantum gravity

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around various approaches to quantum gravity, particularly focusing on the implications of quantum field theory (QFT) in curved spacetime. Participants explore theoretical frameworks, quantization procedures, and the relationship between classical and quantum treatments of gravity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire whether a QFT in curved spacetime can be viewed as simply replacing a Lagrangian in flat Minkowski spacetime with the same Lagrangian in a curved spacetime.
  • There is a question regarding whether a QFT in curved spacetime includes the Einstein action, with responses indicating that it may depend on the specific approach taken.
  • Concerns are raised about the predictive power of QFT in curved spacetime compared to a non-renormalizable quantized Einstein-Hilbert action, particularly due to the necessity of choosing a specific spacetime metric.
  • Some participants suggest that QFT in curved spacetime quantizes matter fields below the Planck scale while utilizing a classical spacetime metric.
  • One participant mentions that perturbatively quantizing the Hilbert action using flat spacetime can yield curved spacetime as a coherent state of gravitons, referencing David Tong's string theory notes.
  • Another participant emphasizes that the name 'QFT in a curved spacetime' encompasses various techniques that may not be directly related, complicating the discussion on predictive capabilities.
  • There is a mention of the potential for interactions on flat spacetime to be summed to produce a background-independent theory, drawing a parallel to concepts in Fierz-Pauli theory.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of QFT in curved spacetime, the role of the Einstein action, and the implications for predictive power. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the quantization procedures and techniques can vary significantly, and the effectiveness of these methods may depend on specific assumptions and definitions. There are also references to various regularization and renormalization schemes that could influence outcomes.

spaghetti3451
Messages
1,311
Reaction score
31
Consider the following paragraph taken from page 30 of Thomas Hartman's lecture notes (http://www.hartmanhep.net/topics2015/) on Quantum Gravity:

Hawking radiation is a feature of QFT in curved spacetime. It does not require that we quantize gravity - it just requires that we quantize the perturbative fields on the black hole background. In fact we can see very similar physics in at spacetime.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. Does a QFT in curved spacetime simply replace a Lagrangian in flat Minkowski spacetime with the same Lagrangian in a given curved spacetime?

2. Does a QFT in curved spacetime not include the Einstein action?

3. Does a QFT in curved spacetime have limited predictive power than the non-renormalizable quantized Einstein-Hibert action coupled to the same QFT, because we have to choose a specific spacetime metric in the former case in order to draw predictions from the theory?

4. Does a QFT in curved spacetime quantize the matter fields which manifest themselves well below the Planck scale, but use a given classical spacetime metric?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Buzz Bloom
Physics news on Phys.org
If you perturbatively quantize the Hilbert action using flat spacetime as a background, you can get curved spacetime as a coherent state of gravitons.

There's some explanation about this in David Tong's string theory notes (chapter 7):
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/tong/string.html
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: spaghetti3451
1) Yes, but that is just schematic. What matters is how you solve the quantization procedure, and there are several different approaches that satisfy your criteria (along with several different regularization and renormalization schemes). You should start with reading Birrel and Davies

2) Again it depends on the approach. In the first naive treatment, the Einstein action remains classical (so its variation remains classical). However, in the semiclassical treatment described in Birrel and Davies, the metric tensor is split into a piece that remains classical, and a small perturbation which is 'quantum'. This piece is included in the matter part of the spacetime and the perturbation series is truncated at first order (which avoids the first pure gravity loop divergence at 2 loops). An effective field theory treatment, on the other hand, keeps all the orders, but requires an unbounded amount of high energy experiments to fix the coefficients.

3) The name 'QFT in a curved spacetime' refers to several differerent techniques that may or may not be simply related, so its difficult to answer your question without more specificity. In general yes, you need to specify a background to get results (but this is no different than say asking the question about what happens in a QCD process in an external electromagnetic field, most techniques will make the approximation that the large external electromagnetic field remains classical and will be unnaffected by any tiny backreaction from the process on itself.

4) See 2.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: spaghetti3451
atyy said:
If you perturbatively quantize the Hilbert action using flat spacetime as a background, you can get curved spacetime as a coherent state of gravitons.

There's some explanation about this in David Tong's string theory notes (chapter 7):
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/tong/string.html
I like the similarity with the identity,

## \frac{\pi^2}{6}=\sum_{n=1}^\infty \frac{1}{n^2} ##

how an infinite sum of fractions can add up to an irrational number. Conceptually, something similar happens in Fierz-Pauli theory (self-interacting spin-2 particles); adding an infinite amount of higher order terms results in a background-independent theory. Interactions on a flat spacetime can be added up to give a curved spacetime.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: atyy

Similar threads

  • · Replies 40 ·
2
Replies
40
Views
7K
  • · Replies 24 ·
Replies
24
Views
8K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
7K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
5K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K