Are there any non-trivial automorphisms of the field Q(sqrt2)?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the automorphisms of the field Q(√2) and the identity automorphism of the field R. Participants explore the implications of polynomial roots and properties of automorphisms in these fields.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the only automorphism of Q(√2) is the identity function based on polynomial properties and the behavior of roots.
  • Another participant questions the conclusion drawn about the identity function, seeking clarification on the reasoning behind it.
  • A different participant proposes a method to prove that the only automorphism of R is the identity function, referencing the fixed point theorem and order preservation.
  • Concerns are raised about the validity of using R\{a} in the proof, as it is not a field, and the implications of transfinite induction are questioned.
  • One participant introduces the concept of automorphisms as symmetries, using the example of the roots of the polynomial x² + 1 = 0 to illustrate potential symmetries in the context of field extensions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conclusions regarding the automorphisms of Q(√2) and R. There is no consensus on the proofs presented, and multiple competing perspectives remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in their arguments, such as the dependence on definitions of fields and the applicability of certain theorems. The discussion reflects uncertainty regarding the use of specific mathematical concepts in proving the identity of automorphisms.

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i need to find how many automorphisms are there for the field Q(sqrt2).
i am given the hint to use the fact that a is a root of a polynomial on Q(sqrt2).
what i did is:
if f:Q(sqrt2)->Q(sqrt2) is an automorphism then if P(x) is a polynomial on this field then:
if a is a root of P(x), then P(a)=0 but then also f(P(a))=f(0)=0
so [tex]P(x)=b_0+b_1x+...+b_nx^n[/tex]
and [tex]f(P(x))=f(b_0)+f(b_1)f(x)+...+f(b_n)f(x)^n[/tex]
they have the same degree, so when f(P(x))=0=P(x)
we have: [tex]f(b_0)+f(b_1)f(x)+...+f(b_n)f(x)^n=b_0+...+b_nx^n[/tex]
from here iv'e concluded that it has only the identity function as an automorphism, am i right?
 
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Why have you concluded that from there?
 
cause f(b_i)f(x)^i=b_ix^i
am i wrong here?
 
ok, iv'e looked in mathworld, i think i got my answer.
 
i have another question.
i need to prove that f:R->R has only the indentity automorphism.
well bacause f preserves order, by the fixed point theorem we can find a point a in R suhc that f(a)=a, now if reuse the automorphism on the field R\{a} we can reuse this theorem and thus by reiterating we can get that f is the identity function, am i right in this way?
 
loop quantum gravity said:
cause f(b_i)f(x)^i=b_ix^i
am i wrong here?

Yes. f is an isomorphism that maps Q to Q. It does not (necessarily) send x to x for all x, merely for x in Q.
 
loop quantum gravity said:
i have another question.
i need to prove that f:R->R has only the indentity automorphism.
well bacause f preserves order, by the fixed point theorem we can find a point a in R suhc that f(a)=a, now if reuse the automorphism on the field R\{a} we can reuse this theorem and thus by reiterating we can get that f is the identity function, am i right in this way?

R\{a} is not a field. R also does not contain a finite number (or even a countable number) of points, and I don't believe you're supposed to use transfinite induction...
 
so how to prove that its only automorphism is the identity function?
 
automorphisms are symmetries.

consider the case of the roots of x^2+1 = 0.

do you see any symmetries among the roots of this one? or of the root field C?

the symmetry you find should leave the real numbers fixed.
 

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