Astrology basic concepts of the study

[Mentat]

It seems to me, after reviewing some old threads where Astrology was debated, that there are (at least) two different basic concepts of the study.

On the one hand, there are those who think that the planets and stars (and their relative positions) has a direct effect on us (our personalities, futures, etc).

On the other hand, there are those who think that astronomical phenomena merely reflect the existing condition of our personalities, futures, etc.

What I'm wondering is: is there any substantiation for either view?

 

[Kerrie]

If you are looking for scientific substantiation, you won't find any Mentat. I have studied astrology (which is considered the study of cycles correlating between human tendencies and celestial bodies), and I have come to conclude that:

a) since human psychology cannot be pinned down to a science, astrology cannot either

OR

b) if it is a science, we have not "progressed" scientifically enough to explain exactly it works.

what i have found in my 12 years of studying is, those who tend to think the planets have a direct impact on us really haven't studied all that long, and those who understand why astrology has the "as above, so below" theme have studied intently on the subject. mentat, keep this in mind if you choose to study anything about astrology:

as above, so below
as within, so without
as the soul, so the universe

the last line is especially important, that explains pretty much that everything in the universe is connected in one way or another (according to astrology), whether our petty little science can explain it or not.

 

[Mentat]

Thank you for your response, Kerrie (I confess, I was hoping you'd comment, since I know you are learned in astrology).

I have further questions, if you don't mind...

1) Is the state "within" merely concomitant with the state "without", or is there an actual "connection" of some sort which facilitates correlation?

2) If there universe were just one of many, then wouldn't it too be considered a form of "within", to be reflected "without" itself? (perhaps among the other universes)

3) Would it be wrong to assume that there may be some sort of empirical or inductive indication of such correlation as you suggest, regardless of whether it is scientifically testable?

Thank you for your patience. I am completely ignorant on this topic.

 

[Nereid]

If you are looking for scientific substantiation, you won't find any Mentat. I have studied astrology (which is considered the study of cycles correlating between human tendencies and celestial bodies), and I have come to conclude that:

a) since human psychology cannot be pinned down to a science, astrology cannot either

Why can't it be so "pinned down"?

OR

b) if it is a science, we have not "progressed" scientifically enough to explain exactly [how] it works.

Hmm, maybe we have different understandings of 'science'! If by 'science' we both mean something like 'the stuff which scientists have been doing for at least a century, maybe as many as five', then surely a more accurate statement would be 'there is no collection of good observations or experiments which are consistent with any well-formulated astrological ideas', wouldn't it?

what i have found in my 12 years of studying is, those who tend to think the planets have a direct impact on us really haven't studied all that long, and those who understand why astrology has the "as above, so below" theme have studied intently on the subject.

So what would a scientific research program into astrology look like?

[...] explains pretty much that everything in the universe is connected in one way or another (according to astrology), whether our petty little science can explain it or not.

But haven't you got the cart before the horse?
IF the universe is so connected (astrology core concept) THEN what specific, concrete, testable predictions follow from this? IF there are none, THEN how could the ideas be reseached (scientifically)?

Put it another way ... what - in some form that is more than just some 'feel-good', vague hand-waving - is there to explain?

 

[Kerrie]

Neried, I would really like to keep this on topic. I have discussed astrology in this forum many times, and usually end up repeating myself over and over. It's quite possible that all of these questions you have can be answered by reading an archived topic. All that I ask is you have confidence in my understanding of the subject as I have put many years and time into understanding it myself. Here is the thread which I felt was quite productive:


The Physics of Astrology
If you have any other questions, let's just reactivate that thread.

 

[K.J.Healey]

First off, anything predicting the future using astrology I view as incorrect. I will not back this up at all.

Secondly, the one relationship that I possibly see between astrology and our personalities is is mroe a relationship between the seasons and our personalities. Depending on what month of the year you're born in, and your lattitude, you may be developing your first experiences either outdoors in the sun in the summer, or inside in the winter, maybe even out in the cold if your parents take you a lot of places. I could see the weather patterns existing during certain crucial parts of your development having a long-term effect on your personality.
Once again, I have no proof to back this up. Mere speculation, but the only logical connection I can think of right now.

 

[Kerrie]

healey, did you read the thread link i posted?

 

[K.J.Healey]

Im sorry, i didnt see it till after I posted. Ill check it out. Thanks.

 

[Mentat]

Kerrie,
Thanks for the link. If you feel this thread is obsolete, in light of its being a repeat, you could lock it (I don't mind).