Can A be Countable if f is 1-1 and Onto?

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on proving that an infinite subset A of a set B, where a function f: ℕ → B is both one-to-one (1-1) and onto, is countable. The initial approach involves defining a function g: ℕ → A, starting with g(1) = f(n_1), where n_1 is the minimum natural number such that f(n) is in A. The participants emphasize the necessity of showing that f(n) and f(n+1) are in A for all natural numbers n, and they discuss the implications of A being countable based on the properties of f.

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  • Understanding of functions, specifically one-to-one (1-1) and onto mappings.
  • Familiarity with the concept of countability in set theory.
  • Knowledge of mathematical induction and its application in proofs.
  • Basic comprehension of subsets and their properties in relation to larger sets.
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  • Explore the definitions and properties of countable and uncountable sets.
  • Learn about bijections and their role in establishing countability.
  • Investigate the implications of functions being one-to-one and onto in set theory.
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Mathematicians, students of set theory, and anyone interested in understanding the concepts of countability and function properties in mathematical proofs.

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Homework Statement


Let [itex]n_1=min(n\in\mathbb{N}:f(n){\in}A)[/itex]
As a start to a definition of g:N→A, set [itex]g(1)=f(n_1)[/itex]
Show how to inductively continue this process to produce a 1-1 function g from
N onto A.

The Attempt at a Solution


[itex]g(1)=f(n_1)[/itex] so this is our base case for induction.
so [itex]g(2)=f(n_1+1)[/itex]
If I understand this correctly g is a function that has input values of natural numbers and maps these to the set A.
So I guess I need to show that f(n) is in A and f(n+1) is in A
By definition f(n) is in A for all n, so f(n+1) is in A for all n.
Could I maybe do a proof by contradiction and assume that f(n+1) was not in A and show that it was because n+1 is in the Naturals, therefore it works for f(n), and f(n+1)
 
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Are there some additional assumptions that you haven't listed? It is obviously not going to be possible to construct a bijection between [itex]\mathbb{N}[/itex] and [itex]A[/itex] unless [itex]A[/itex] is countable. Also, there must be some assumption about [itex]f[/itex]. In general, the set [itex]\{n \in \mathbb{N} : f(n) \in A\}[/itex] could be empty, in which case the minimum isn't even defined.
 
ok, you sorry, It says there exists [itex]f:\mathbb{N} --->B[/itex] which is 1-1 and onto.
Let [itex]A\subseteq B[/itex] be an infinite subset of B.We must show that A is countable. The question was phrased in 2 parts and I thought they were separate.
Thanks for looking at that.
 

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