Can Derivative Operators Be Treated Like Fractions in Integration?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the treatment of derivative operators in integration, specifically whether they can be manipulated similarly to fractions. Participants explore the implications of this approach in the context of calculus and the fundamental theorem of calculus.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the validity of treating the derivative operator as a fraction in integration, referencing common teachings that discourage this interpretation.
  • Another participant asserts that the derivative is fundamentally a limit of a fraction, while the integral represents a limit of a summation, suggesting a connection between the two concepts.
  • A third participant explains that the derivative notation can be integrated according to the fundamental theorem of calculus, emphasizing that boundary conditions can help determine constants in the integration process.
  • A later reply acknowledges the previous explanation and expresses newfound interest in the topic.
  • One participant references a previous discussion, suggesting that the integration process involves manipulating the derivative in a specific way, indicating a potential overlap with earlier conversations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of derivative operators in integration. Some support the idea that they can be treated like fractions, while others caution against this perspective, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the manipulation of derivative operators and the definitions of the terms involved. The discussion does not resolve these complexities.

ronaldor9
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How is it possible that one can break up the derivative operator such as this:

[tex]\frac{dv}{dt}=t^2[/tex], then integrate like this,
[tex]\int^v_{v_{0}}dv = \int^t_0 t^2 dt[/tex], where[tex]v=v_{o}[/tex] when [tex]t=0[/tex]. Especially in light of what most calculus teachers tell you; that the derivative symbol is not a fraction and should not be interpreted as a faction?
 
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The derivative is a limit of a fraction and the integral is a limit of a summation of function values times a step length.
 
dv/dt is a function v'(t), and since it is a derivative, it is integrable by the fundamental theorem of calculus to v(t) + C where C is an undetermined constant.
If f(t) = g(t) and f(t) is integrable, then [itex]\int f = (\int g) + C[/itex] where C is an undetermined constant. Your use of boundary conditions (v(0) = v0) allows you to determine the constant.
That's all that's being done here. The Leibnitz notation is just a neat way of writing it out, but don't take it too seriously until you learn the proper way to manipulate differential forms.
 
wow thanks slider. I never have thought about it that way, but now that you have explained it, it is very interesting!
 
This was discussed in another thread.

What you're really integrating on the right side is [tex]\int^v_{v_{0}} \frac {dv}{dt} dt[/tex]
 

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