Can Euler Integration Simplify Chaotic Systems?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the application of Euler integration to a modified Hamiltonian chaotic system, specifically based on the Henon-Heiles chaotic system. Participants explore how to convert continuous variables into discrete functions and the implications of using Euler integration in chaotic systems.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks to understand how to express the chaotic system's variables as discrete functions, specifically asking for clarity on the integration process.
  • Another participant points out that the equations presented include four variables, suggesting that the simplest representation may already be provided in the material shared.
  • A later reply emphasizes that the initial variables are time-dependent and questions how to transition from differential equations to difference equations.
  • One participant provides a basic formula for Euler integration, indicating that while it is a simple approach, it may not yield stable orbits and suggests looking for better methods.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding regarding the integration of variables and the application of Euler integration. There is no consensus on the best approach to take or the effectiveness of Euler integration in this context.

Contextual Notes

Participants indicate a lack of familiarity with chaotic systems and integration techniques, which may affect their understanding of the discussion. The transition from differential to difference equations remains unresolved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in chaotic systems, numerical methods for integration, and those studying the application of these concepts in cryptography.

ohaited
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Hey, I have this chaotic system. It is a modified Hamiltonian Chaotic System and it is based on Henon-Heiles chaotic system. So I have this functions (as shown below). I want to know how can I make it as a discrete function. Like, how can I know the value for x dot and y dot.

henon heiles.jpg
1. Prefer to know it in a simple way, take it as someone who doesn't have physics fundamental but want to know about these two chaotic system. Really appreciate you help.

Oh, and yeah. If there any misinterpret for keyword. Do correct me :)

Thanks :)
 

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ohaited said:
Prefer to know it in a simple way
Isn't equation (5) in your picture the simplest representation ? You do have four variables to integrate, not two ...
 
BvU said:
Isn't equation (5) in your picture the simplest representation ? You do have four variables to integrate, not two ...

Oh really? I don't quite get what you want to tell me. Can you tell me a little bit more detail? Like how do I integrate all these variables?

P/s: I'm new with all these chaotic system, this study is for the purpose of studying chaotic map for my crypto-system.
 
Your initial variables are ##x,\dot x, y, \dot y## and all four develop in time according to the equations (5)
 
BvU said:
Your initial variables are ##x,\dot x, y, \dot y## and all four develop in time according to the equations (5)
Oh, okay. So it is a time dependent variables. So how do I integrate those variables. The ##\dot x, \dot y## as far as I knew it is differential equation. How to make it difference equation.
 
##x_{n+1} = x_{n} + v_n \Delta t ##
##v_{n+1} = -x_{n} -2 x_n y_n\Delta t \ ## etc.

This is the simples approach, called Euler integration. It won't give you nice stable orbits, so you may way to search for better integration methods.
 

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