Can Two Electrons in an Atom Share the Same Quantum Numbers?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Pauli exclusion principle and whether it allows two electrons in an atom to share the same quantum numbers. Participants explore the implications of this principle in the context of quantum mechanics, particularly focusing on the behavior of electrons as fermions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the Pauli exclusion principle states that no two electrons in an atom can have the same quantum numbers.
  • One participant questions whether the original inquiry pertains to the correctness of the exclusion principle itself or its specific statement.
  • A participant explains the distinction between bosons and fermions, noting that electrons are fermions and thus cannot occupy the same quantum state.
  • Another participant provides an example involving helium and lithium atoms to illustrate how electrons in different spin states occupy the same shell, but cannot share the same quantum state.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There appears to be general agreement on the statement of the Pauli exclusion principle, but some uncertainty exists regarding the interpretation of the principle and its implications.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the definitions of quantum states and the nature of fermions may not be fully articulated, and the discussion does not resolve the nuances of the principle's application in different atomic contexts.

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I was told that the pauli exclusion principle states that no two electrons in an atom can have the same quantum numbers is it ture need answers!
 
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i know it all said:
is it true?

yes.
 
Are you asking if that that's what the pauli exclusion principle states?

Or if the exclusion principle is right?

Have you tried google yet?
 
If you know a bit about quantum then this should be nice way of explaining things:
Given a wavefuntion W(x,y) of two identical particles in states x and y. we say that the particles are bosons if the wavefunction is symmetric under particle exchange i.e. W(x,y) = W(y,x), and they are fermions if the wavefunction is anti-symmetric under particle exchange i.e. W(x,y) = -W(y,x)

Now, a simple consequence for Fermions is that if the two particles are in the same state, then we have W(x,x) = -W(x,x) = 0, hence the probability of two fermions being in the same state is zero. This is the Pauli Exclusion Principle.

Oh, and electrons are fermions, hence no two electrons can be in the same state and therefore no two electrons in an atom can have the same quantum number. As an example, in the Helium Atom, you have two electrons and whilst they may be in the same "shell", one will be in a spin up state and one will be in a spin down state. When you move on to Lithium, the third electron cannot be in the same state as the first two and hence occupies a new shell
 

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