Chunks of action smaller than Planck's constant

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the relationship between static electric charges and the quantization of action, specifically in the context of the equation F r² = N₁ N₂ α ℏ. Here, F represents the force, r is the mutual distance, α is the fine structure constant, and ℏ is Planck's reduced constant. The analysis reveals that measuring changes in force can indicate action changes smaller than Planck's constant, challenging the notion of quantization in units of ℏ. Additionally, the conversation references A. Neumaier's insights on the continuous nature of action in classical physics, emphasizing that action is not exclusively a quantum phenomenon.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of static electric forces and Coulomb's law
  • Familiarity with quantum mechanics concepts, particularly Planck's constant (ℏ)
  • Knowledge of the fine structure constant (α) and its significance
  • Basic grasp of phase space and conjugate quantities in physics
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  • Explore the implications of the fine structure constant (α) in quantum electrodynamics
  • Investigate the role of action in classical mechanics versus quantum mechanics
  • Learn about phase space physics and its applications in quantum theory
  • Examine A. Neumaier's contributions to the understanding of action as a physical observable
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gerald V
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TL;DR
The force law for electric charges allows to observe actions smaller than Plancks constant
The force two static electric charges exert on each other fulfills (velocity of light set unity)
\begin{equation}
F r^2 = N_1 N_2 \alpha \hbar \;,
\end{equation}
where ##F## is the force, ##r## is the mutual distance, ##\alpha## is the dimensionless fine structure constant, ##\hbar## is Planck's (reduced) constant and ##N_1 , N_2## are whole numbers, respectively. Both sides of the equation have the dimension of ##action##.

If one holds one of the ##N## at the value unity and lets the other jump by plus/minus unity, the absolute value of the l.h.s.\ changes by an amount of ##\alpha \hbar \approx \frac {\hbar}{137}##.
This means by measuring the change of force at any given distance one can immediately observe a jump of action significantly smaller than Planck's constant.

So what about the quantization of action in units of ##\hbar##? Where is it valid and where is it not?
Is there any phase space physics behind the above? In particular, do ##Fr## (has dimension of ##momentum##) and ##r## span something like phase space? Are these conjugate quantities?
If not, why is there quantization (in smaller chunks, though)?

Thank you very much in advance.
 
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gerald V said:
So what about the quantization of action in units of ##\hbar##? Where is it valid and where is it not?
Is there any phase space physics behind the above? In particular, do ##Fr## (has dimension of ##momentum##) and ##r## span something like phase space? Are these conjugate quantities?
If not, why is there quantization (in smaller chunks, though)?
The notion that action is quantized is an artifact of the "old" quantum theory from before 1925. This is discussed by @A. Neumaier (a frequent contributor to Physics Forums) in his first answer here: https://physics.stackexchange.com/q...-sense-if-any-is-action-a-physical-observable, from which I quote:
"The action of a system along a fixed dynamically-allowed path depends on an assumed initial time and final time, and it goes to zero as these times approach each other - this holds even when it is an operator. Hence its eigenvalues are continuous in time and must go to zero when the time interval tends to zero. This is incompatible with a spectrum consisting of integral or half integral multiples of ℏ."
 
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gerald V said:
The force two static electric charges exert on each other fulfills (velocity of light set unity)
\begin{equation}
F r^2 = N_1 N_2 \alpha \hbar \;,
\end{equation}
where ##F## is the force, ##r## is the mutual distance, ##\alpha## is the dimensionless fine structure constant, ##\hbar## is Planck's (reduced) constant and ##N_1 , N_2## are whole numbers, respectively. Both sides of the equation have the dimension of ##action##.
What does this equation have to do with quantum mechanics? It happens to have ##\hbar## in it because of how you chose to define your units, but that doesn't make it a quantum equation. Action is not an inherently quantum quantity; classical physics can be formulated in terms of action too. Your equation is a simple example of such a formulation.
 
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