The discussion centers on the quest for a classical or empirical potential that accurately describes electron-ion interactions, distinct from the Coulomb potential. Participants highlight the need for a potential that captures the shielding effect of the nucleus on valence electrons, which are unbound and do not follow classical mechanics. The conversation references the Hartree-Fock method and density functional theory as potential frameworks for understanding these interactions, emphasizing the limitations of classical mechanics in atomic physics.
PREREQUISITESPhysicists, chemists, and researchers in atomic and molecular physics seeking to understand electron-ion interactions and the limitations of classical models in describing quantum behavior.
Why should the electron be prevented from "hitting" the nucleus?feynman1 said:Thanks. How is shielded potential of the nucleus expressed?
A valence one can at most stay on the outermost layer let alone hitting the centre.nasu said:Why should the electron be prevented from "hitting" the nucleus?
Here are some referencesfeynman1 said:Thanks. How is shielded potential of the nucleus expressed?
Have you ever seen an image of probability distribution for s-type orbitals? Electrons in atoms are described by quantum mechanics. They don't sit on layers like books in the library.feynman1 said:A valence one can at most stay on the outermost layer let alone hitting the centre.
Yes. Any emperical potential (well) able to describe such s type 'bonding' between an electron and ion?nasu said:Have you ever seen an image of probability distribution for s-type orbitals? Electrons in atoms are described by quantum mechanics. They don't sit on layers like books in the library.
Thanks but I didn't find any help from there talking about any potential functionmfb said:
These are obtained by solving Schroedinger equation with Coulomb potential. Is done (for hydrogen atom) in introductory QM courses.feynman1 said:Yes. Any emperical potential (well) able to describe such s type 'bonding' between an electron and ion?
OK, I actually was looking for a potential that works in classical mechanics, namely some potential+'F=ma'nasu said:These are obtained by solving Schroedinger equation with Coulomb potential. Is done (for hydrogen atom) in introductory QM courses.
God luck with that...feynman1 said:You do understand that it wasa atomic OK, I actually was looking for a potential that works in classical mechanics, namely some potential+'F=ma'
Yes I knew thanks. Wasn't looking for any precise QM theory.hutchphd said:God luck with that...
You do understand that it was problems with atomic physics that precipitated the invention of Quantum Mechanics? The best you can do is some sort of mean firld theory (which is Hartree-Fock as I recall)
Thanks, though indeed more than I want to know.hutchphd said:More than you want to know !:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Density_functional_theory