Coefficients in the Schrodinger equation and the momentum operator

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Shen712
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Quantum physics
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the coefficients in the Schrödinger equation and the momentum operator in quantum mechanics, specifically why the coefficients are set as ##\hbar## and ##-i\hbar##, respectively. Participants emphasize that altering these coefficients would lead to results inconsistent with experimental data. The conversation also touches on the commutation relations between position and momentum operators, which are fundamental to quantum mechanics. The importance of established quantum mechanics principles over personal theories is highlighted, leading to the closure of the thread due to forum rules.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of the Schrödinger equation and its components
  • Familiarity with quantum mechanics principles, particularly commutation relations
  • Knowledge of the momentum operator and its significance in quantum mechanics
  • Basic grasp of fermions and their spin characteristics
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation and implications of the Schrödinger equation in quantum mechanics
  • Explore the concept of commutation relations in quantum mechanics, particularly the position and momentum operators
  • Investigate the role of Planck's constant in quantum mechanics and its experimental significance
  • Learn about the double cover of ##SO(3)## and its relation to particle spin
USEFUL FOR

Students and researchers in quantum mechanics, physicists interested in the foundational principles of quantum theory, and anyone seeking to understand the mathematical structure of quantum operators.

Shen712
Messages
12
Reaction score
0
TL;DR
How are the coefficients in the Schrodinger equation and the momentum operator determined?
The Schrödinger equation is

$$
i\hbar \frac{\partial\Psi}{\partial t} = -\frac{\hbar^{2}}{2m} \frac{\partial^{2}\Psi}{\partial x^{2}} + V \Psi
$$

Why is the coeffient on the left-hand side ##\hbar##, not ##\frac{\hbar}{2}## or ##i\frac{\hbar}{3}## or something like these
Besides, in quantum mechanics, the momentum operator is defined to be

$$
p \rightarrow -i\hbar \frac{\partial}{\partial x}
$$

Again, why is the coefficient ##-i\hbar##, not ##-i\frac{\hbar}{2}## or ##-i\frac{\hbar}{3}## or something like these?

[Mentor's note: post edited to fix some Latex formatting]
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org
How did you get the idea of fraction as alternative ? Commutation relation of x and p would be helpful.
 
Last edited:
You might start with the early chapters of Ballentine.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71
If you stick in different constants, you would get different answers which would not agree with experiment.

The SE was inspired by classical equations. Here is a brief description of what Schrödinger did from Borowitz (1967).

IMG_0013.jpegIMG_0014.jpegIMG_0015.jpegIMG_0016.jpeg
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: topsquark
anuttarasammyak said:
How did you get the idea of fraction as alternative ? Commutation relation of x and p would be helpful.
I got the idea of fraction because I believe electrons have substructure, and each component of the electron must have a spin smaller than $\frac{\hbar}{2}$, say, $\frac{\hbar}{4}$ or $\frac{\hbar}{6}$. But this would violate our convention that fermions have spin $\frac{\hbar}{2}$. As I try to trace out the origin of the fermion spin $\frac{\hbar}{2}$, I found that it has to do with the constant coefficients in the Schrödinger equation (and/or the Dirac equation) and the momentum operator (the commutation relation of x and p can be traced to the definition of the p operator). So I am thinking that the Schrödinger equation (and/or the Dirac equation) and the momentum operator might be modified in order to describe the spin of the components of the electron. Am I on the right track?
 
Last edited:
  • Skeptical
Likes   Reactions: Vanadium 50, weirdoguy and PeroK
Shen712 said:
Am I on the right track?
In OP you did not state what the particle is but you are wondering about electrons in #5. Why don't you forget about spins now? Spin appears later in advanced treatment and it does not harm the first lessons.

Have you followed my suggesion?
\frac{\partial }{\partial x}xf - x\frac{\partial }{\partial x}f = f
for any f so
\frac{\partial }{\partial x}x - x\frac{\partial }{\partial x} = 1
as an operator so
-i\hbar \frac{\partial}{\partial x}x - x(- i\hbar) \frac{\partial }{\partial x} = -i\hbar
px - xp = -i\hbar
which meets commutation relation which is one of QM principles. Ref. (20.74) in https://www.feynmanlectures.caltech.edu/III_20.html "If Planck’s constant were zero, the classical and quantum results would be the same, and there would be no quantum mechanics to learn!"
 
Shen712 said:
Am I on the right track?

No, and if you don't know where does the spin come from (eg. you don't know what is the double cover of ##SO(3)##) then surely you are not prepared to do any reasearch on a structure of electron. Besides, PF rules forbid talking about personal theories.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: DrClaude
The forum rules do not allow discussion of unpublished personal theories, so this thread has been closed.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Vanadium 50 and PeroK

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 56 ·
2
Replies
56
Views
5K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
2K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K