Convergence of Roots at Infinity

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem from Spivak's calculus concerning the behavior of the expression \(c^{\frac{1}{n}}\) as \(n\) approaches infinity, specifically for cases where \(c > 1\) and \(0 < c < 1\). The original poster is attempting to prove that \(c^{\frac{1}{n}}\) approaches 1 under these conditions, with a focus on the limits and the implications of the Bernoulli inequality.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster successfully addresses part (a) of the problem but struggles with part (b), particularly for the case \(0 < c < 1\). They explore the implications of the Bernoulli inequality and consider the behavior of \((1/c)^n\) as \(n\) increases. Other participants raise similar questions about the limits and suggest alternative approaches to the problem.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, exploring different angles and questioning assumptions. Some have suggested using the relationship between \(c^{\frac{1}{n}}\) and \((1/c)^{\frac{1}{n}}\) to gain insights into the behavior of the expression as \(n\) grows large. There is a recognition of the challenges involved, particularly with the lack of established results about sequences at this stage in the textbook.

Contextual Notes

The original poster notes that the textbook has not yet covered continuous functions, derivatives, integrals, or sequences, which may limit the tools available for solving the problem. There is also mention of the absence of solutions in the answer book for part (b), indicating a potential gap in guidance for this specific case.

Adgorn
Messages
133
Reaction score
19

Homework Statement


Hi everyone, I'm currently making my way through Spivak's calculus and got stuck in question 41 of chapter 5. It's important to note that at this point, the book has only reached the subject of limits (haven't reached continuous functions, derivatives, integrals, series etc.).

a) For ##c>1##, show that ##c^{\frac 1 n}=\sqrt[n] c## approaches 1 as ##n## becomes very large.
b) More generally, if ##c>0##, then ##c^{\frac 1 n}## approaches 1 as ##n## becomes very large.

Homework Equations


Bernoulli inequality: ##(1+h)^n≥1+nh## for ##h>-1##

The Attempt at a Solution


I managed to solve a): Since ##c>1##, ##c^{\frac 1 n}>1##. So suppose ##c^{\frac 1 n}-1>\epsilon##, in other words ##c>(1+\epsilon)^n≥1+n\epsilon##, this means that ##n<\frac {c-1} \epsilon##. Thus, for ##n≥\frac {c-1} \epsilon##, ##1<c^{\frac 1 n}<\epsilon##. This solution is the same in the answer book.

I got stuck in b) (the answer book does not contain a solution for it, neither does the end of the study book). The case is trivial for ##c=1##, so all that's really left to prove is the case for ##0<c<1##, which I can't seem to manage. Since ##c^{\frac 1 n}<1##, I need to prove ##1-c^{\frac 1 n}<\epsilon##. Trying to same method as in a), if ##1-c^{\frac 1 n}>\epsilon##, then ##c<(1-\epsilon)^n##. This time, the Bernoulli inequality is of little use, assuming ##\epsilon<1##, all it gives it ##(1-\epsilon)^n≥1-n\epsilon##, and I can't really do anything with that.

Next I tried reverse engineering, if ##1-c^{\frac 1 n}<\epsilon##, then ##c>(1-\epsilon)^n≥1-n\epsilon## (assuming ##\epsilon<1##), and so ##n>\frac {1-c} \epsilon##. But I can't prove the opposite way (which is what I need), since assuming ##n>\frac {1-c} \epsilon## only gives ##c>1-n\epsilon##, and I can't really do anything with it.

So yeah, I seem to be missing something and help would be appreciated.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
What is ##(1/c)^n## if ##0<c<1##?
 
Orodruin said:
What is ##(1/c)^n## if ##0<c<1##?
When ##n## grows very large it approaches infinity, but I don't seem to be able to incorporate that into the solution. The comment gave me the idea to replace the ##c>1## in the proof of a) with ##\frac 1 c>1## so that ##0<c<1##, but I reached the same dead end where I can only say how small ##n## is if I assume ##\epsilon<1##...
 
Has Spivak proven basic results about limits of sums, products and quotients of sequences at this point? If so, you should be able to establish the following proposition:

If a_n is a sequence such that \lim_{n \to \infty} a_n = 1 then <br /> \lim_{n \to \infty} \frac 1{a_n} = 1.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Adgorn
Adgorn said:
When ##n## grows very large it approaches infinity, but I don't seem to be able to incorporate that into the solution. The comment gave me the idea to replace the ##c>1## in the proof of a) with ##\frac 1 c>1## so that ##0<c<1##, but I reached the same dead end where I can only say how small ##n## is if I assume ##\epsilon<1##...
Sorry, I meant to write ##(1/c)^{1/n}##. How does this number behave as ##n## becomes large and how does it relate to ##c^{1/n}##?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Adgorn
pasmith said:
Has Spivak proven basic results about limits of sums, products and quotients of sequences at this point? If so, you should be able to establish the following proposition:

If a_n is a sequence such that \lim_{n \to \infty} a_n = 1 then <br /> \lim_{n \to \infty} \frac 1{a_n} = 1.
At this point he has not touched sequences at all, this question is more of a sneak peak than anything else.

Orodruin said:
Sorry, I meant to write ##(1/c)^{1/n}##. How does this number behave as ##n## becomes large and how does it relate to ##c^{1/n}##?
Got it. If ##0<c<1##, then ##0<c^{\frac 1 n}<1## and ##0<1<\frac 1 c##. This means that by a), if ##n>\frac {\frac 1 c-1} \epsilon>0##, then ##\frac 1 {c^\frac 1 n}-1<\epsilon##, meaning that ##1-c^\frac 1 n<\epsilon c^\frac 1 n<\epsilon##.
Thanks for the help.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
4K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K