Did Floyd Landis Use External Testosterone?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the allegations of doping against cyclist Floyd Landis, specifically regarding the presence of external testosterone in his urine samples. Participants explore the implications of carbon isotope ratio tests, the reliability of doping tests, and the broader context of doping in cycling and other sports.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express frustration over doping allegations in cycling, citing Landis and others like Tyler Hamilton and Lance Armstrong as examples of a larger issue within the sport.
  • Concerns are raised about the validity of the carbon isotope ratio test used on Landis's urine sample, with some suggesting it may not be definitive evidence of doping.
  • One participant notes that the elevated testosterone levels in Landis's sample were not extraordinarily high compared to other cases, questioning the severity of the findings.
  • There is speculation about the possibility of sample contamination affecting the test results, particularly given that only one of Landis's samples tested positive.
  • Some participants discuss the lack of comprehensive studies validating the carbon isotope ratio test, particularly in non-athlete populations, suggesting that results may be misinterpreted.
  • Dietary factors are mentioned as potential influences on carbon isotope ratios, raising questions about the test's reliability in determining doping.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of opinions, with no clear consensus on the validity of the doping allegations against Landis or the reliability of the testing methods used. Multiple competing views remain regarding the implications of the test results and the broader context of doping in sports.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight limitations in the current understanding of the carbon isotope ratio test and its application, including potential confounding factors such as dietary changes and sample contamination. There is also mention of the small sample size in mass spectrometry affecting the reliability of results.

  • #31
Gokul43201 said:
I don't get this either. I think dope tests are performed on all track athletes before every heat in an Olympic event. Why not here? This random sampling business is just weird.
It's almost like an out, isn't it? If, hypothetically, everyone in the race was doping, and they're only testing the top 3 or so at each stage, plus a handful of randomly selected competitors, one could strategize and drop back to 4th place at every stage to avoid testing, and come out the winner while still doping.

Having only one or two samples during a race also more readily opens it up to challenge. You can argue almost any excuse you want to, and there's no evidence from earlier or later samples to prove otherwise.

From a scientific perspective, I'd also be really interested in seeing how the overall profiles look throughout the course of such a prolonged endurance challenge. With such physical and mental stress, I would predict you'd see quite a bit of changing hormone levels as the race progresses, or that you might see a change in the first few days that then levels off as the body compensates. If such changes weren't observed, it sure would toss a few hypotheses regarding stress/hormone interactions out the window. Having a good profile from a large cohort of athletes in a particular sport will also help validate the use of a single sampling procedure in the future if that's what they intend to use. But, before you can claim you know anything from a single sample, you really do need to know what happens over time in a series of samples.
 
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  • #32
This makes me feel a little better. Colbert is the only one who's jokes on the matter made me laugh.
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  • #33
Chi Meson said:
This makes me feel a little better. Colbert's jokes
:smile: Of course he's got high levels of testosterone . . . He's an American. :smile: :cry: :smile:
 

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