Did Verizon make a math mistake on my bill?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a perceived billing error by Verizon, specifically concerning the interpretation of charges expressed in cents. Participants explore the implications of misunderstandings related to billing terminology and the potential for miscommunication between customers and representatives. The conversation touches on aspects of customer service, contract law, and the clarity of marketing materials.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the confusion arose from a miscommunication between the customer and the Verizon representative regarding the meaning of "cents."
  • Others argue that the marketing staff intentionally misused the term "cents," leading to customer confusion.
  • A participant mentions having seen the original training document, claiming it was worded incorrectly, while asserting that the billing system was programmed correctly according to the contract.
  • Some participants propose that if both the customer and the salesperson believed the cost was .002 cents, then that should be considered the agreed price, potentially indicating an error in the billing system.
  • There are comments about the general difficulty people have with understanding fractions and orders of magnitude, which may contribute to billing misunderstandings.
  • One participant raises the question of whether the error was in the bill or in promotional materials, suggesting it could be considered false advertising regardless of the contract wording.
  • Several participants express frustration with the perceived lack of mathematical understanding among customer service representatives.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views, with no clear consensus on whether the issue stems from a misunderstanding, a marketing strategy, or a technical error in billing. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of the contract and the responsibilities of the company.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the potential for confusion due to the wording in training documents and marketing materials, as well as the complexities of contract law that may not be well understood by customers.

moe darklight
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:smile::smile: This is why you got to check your bills carefully. This same thing happened to my mom's friend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCJ3Oz5JVKs
 
Mathematics news on Phys.org
LOL. what a bunch of scammers. they just WONT admit it said CENTS.

thats great
 
That's old.

The rep said it wrong, but the customer also didn't understand the policy. IIRC his bill was correct, she was explaining it wrong.
 
The verizon people on the phone are just idiots, but somewhere higher up, the marketing staff intentionally decided to misuse the word "cents" knowing full well the confusion it would cause.
 
maze said:
The verizon people on the phone are just idiots, but somewhere higher up, the marketing staff intentionally decided to misuse the word "cents" knowing full well the confusion it would cause.
I saw the original training document, it's was worded wrong by someone that couldn't count. The billing system was programmed correctly though, so he was billed per his contract. (I worked for a competitor, so it was funny at the time).
 
Evo said:
I saw the original training document, it's was worded wrong by someone that couldn't count. The billing system was programmed correctly though, so he was billed per his contract. (I worked for a competitor, so it was funny at the time).

If he genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents (rather than .2 cents), and the salesperson genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents, then the "meeting of the minds" was on the price of .002 cents, so that is the contract. Period. In that case the computer program is _not_ programmed correctly - it is wrongly overcharging him.
 
If he would have just explained that one is a "fraction of a dollar" and the other is a "fraction of a cent" I think the supervisor could have understood that.
 
Greg Bernhardt said:
If he would have just explained that one is a "fraction of a dollar" and the other is a "fraction of a cent" I think the supervisor could have understood that.

More likely the supervisor would have heard the word "fraction" and immediately tuned out since they "never understood fractions in school".
 
maze said:
More likely the supervisor would have heard the word "fraction" and immediately tuned out since they "never understood fractions in school".

It's like when someone needs to add two digit numbers or something, and they say "I was never good at math".
 
  • #10
Evo said:
I saw the original training document, it's was worded wrong by someone that couldn't count. The billing system was programmed correctly though, so he was billed per his contract. (I worked for a competitor, so it was funny at the time).

O, I'd never seen it before.

Wait, so was this a typo in the bill, or in a pamphlet? -- I don't understand how a customer would be confused over a training video.

either way, it seems to be an error on verizon's side, and it's pretty funny that the woman at the end can concede that there is a difference between half of a dollar and hald of a cent, but believes the difference between 0.002 dollars and 0.002 cent to be "a matter of opinion" :biggrin:
 
  • #11
maze said:
If he genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents (rather than .2 cents), and the salesperson genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents, then the "meeting of the minds" was on the price of .002 cents, so that is the contract. Period. In that case the computer program is _not_ programmed correctly - it is wrongly overcharging him.

Couldn't agree more.

Not that many people know law though. Kind of like the post...

https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=2119200&postcount=2

So, basically half-baked ideas are being thrown around here about legal issues.

I hope the guy won though.
 
  • #12
moe darklight said:
O, I'd never seen it before.

Wait, so was this a typo in the bill, or in a pamphlet? -- I don't understand how a customer would be confused over a training video.

either way, it seems to be an error on verizon's side, and it's pretty funny that the woman at the end can concede that there is a difference between half of a dollar and hald of a cent, but believes the difference between 0.002 dollars and 0.002 cent to be "a matter of opinion" :biggrin:

It was on all the PR material. I have no idea what was on the contract, since that would probably be done by a different department. I imagine it could still be considered false advertising, regardless of the wording of the contract.
 
  • #13
I remember this from a few years ago, it's still sad to see how stupid people can be.
 
  • #14
"Wait, I'm teaching you math here..."

The opinion part was great as well. They get the phone people to think in dollars, so when they see a decimal point, it's obviously in dollars, no matter what word/symbol is around it.

The sad thing is, they make more than enough money from those who don't question it to pay those who do, and still make money through deception.
 
  • #15
maze said:
If he genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents (rather than .2 cents), and the salesperson genuinely thought the cost was .002 cents, then the "meeting of the minds" was on the price of .002 cents, so that is the contract. Period. In that case the computer program is _not_ programmed correctly - it is wrongly overcharging him.

JasonRox said:
Couldn't agree more.

Not that many people know law though. Kind of like the post...

https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=2119200&postcount=2

So, basically half-baked ideas are being thrown around here about legal issues.

I hope the guy won though.
What is in a written contract will supercede anything that is accidently verbally misquoted. Whether a company wants to make an "adjustment to satisfy", is completely up to them. Cell phone customers often do not realize they are under a written contract, usually posted somewhere on the providers website.
 
  • #16
Lots of people have trouble evaluating different orders of magnitude.

1000 times (these cartoons always have a hidden subtext that's revealed by moving your cursor over the cartoon, itself).
 
  • #17
BobG said:
Lots of people have trouble evaluating different orders of magnitude.

1000 times (these cartoons always have a hidden subtext that's revealed by moving your cursor over the cartoon, itself).

:eek: I never noticed! that was cool :biggrin:

I always get frustrated when news articles talk about billions, because I grew up with 1 billion = 1 000 000 million, same for trillion, etc.
 

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