Different approches to Geometry

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around different approaches to geometry, particularly focusing on the definition of geometry as a set and its subsets, as well as the relationship between vector spaces and geometry. Participants explore the implications of using sets of matrices in geometric definitions and the connection to manifold geometry.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes geometry as a non-empty set and a subset of its power set, defining points and lines based on these sets.
  • Another participant identifies this approach as incidence geometry and discusses the possibility of using the set of all 2x2 matrices to build a geometry, suggesting that each vector space induces a geometry.
  • A participant elaborates on the relationship between vector spaces and geometry, indicating that the points will be vectors and lines will be defined as sets of the form u+span(v).
  • Another contributor emphasizes the importance of metrics, norms, and inner products in defining geometry through distance and angle attributes, suggesting that adding topology and smooth structures allows for calculus applications in geometry.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the definitions and approaches to geometry, with no consensus reached on the best method or the implications of using matrices. The discussion remains open-ended with multiple competing views.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention different mathematical concepts such as vector spaces, incidence geometry, and manifold geometry without resolving the relationships or dependencies between these concepts. There is also a lack of consensus on the definitions and implications of the terms used.

ShayanJ
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I read somewhere that a Geometry is a non Empty set and a subset of its power set which has subsets with at least two elements.The elements of the first set are called points and the elements of the second set are called lines.With specifying these two sets and considering some axioms,you will get a geometry.Now I have two questions.
1-As with vector spaces(which you can define things as vectors too different from arrows in space),Can I build a geomery with e.g. the set of all 2x2 matrices?
2-What is the relationship of this approach to geometry with the manifold geometry?

thanks
 
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Shyan said:
I read somewhere

Probably you would more likely get some answer if you could remember "where".
 
Shyan said:
I read somewhere that a Geometry is a non Empty set and a subset of its power set which has subsets with at least two elements.The elements of the first set are called points and the elements of the second set are called lines.With specifying these two sets and considering some axioms,you will get a geometry.Now I have two questions.

That's the incidence geometry- approach to geometry.

1-As with vector spaces(which you can define things as vectors too different from arrows in space),Can I build a geomery with e.g. the set of all 2x2 matrices?

Certainly, the set of all 2x2-matrices is a vector space, and each vector space induces a geometry. The points will be the vectors and the lines will be sets of the form u+span(v) with v nonzero. Thus the lines through the origin will be the one-dimensional subspaces.

As a geometry, the set of all 2x2-matrices will be isomorphic to the geometry \mathbb{R}^4.
 
Hey Shyan.

It may help you to think about geometry through distance and angle attributes.

We have a variety of terms including metrics, norms, and inner products which help define these things precisely and give the conditions that these must have in order to be actual term.

Vector spaces and linear algebra (as well as multilinear algebra) will give you the foundations for thinking about these kinds of things.

If you add say topology then you get some precise definitions for things like continuity. By adding concepts like "smooth" (it's not the best way I can describe this so maybe someone can jump in with a better definition), then you are able to look at geometries that you can apply 'calculus' to which gives you another tool to analyze these in the context of geometry.

By knowing distance and angle, of which for the smooth structures has a differential form which is written in terms of infinitesimals (like you see with your standard differential equations), then you can get an expression for distance between one point and another point "close" to that point in a given 'direction' (This depends on the parameterization of the actual geometry) and along with other calculus techniques you are able to then calculate 'distance' (or an approximation if you can't get an analytic solution) and also 'angle' if you have a valid inner product.
 

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