Differentiating thermodynamic coefficients

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion centers around the differentiation of thermodynamic coefficients, specifically the isothermal compressibility coefficient and the volumetric thermal expansion coefficient. The original poster is tasked with demonstrating a specific equality involving these coefficients and expresses confusion regarding the implications of partial differentiation under constant conditions.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to understand the implications of differentiating the volumetric thermal expansion coefficient with respect to pressure while assuming constant temperature, questioning the validity of this approach. Other participants engage in clarifying the functional dependencies of the coefficients and the meaning of partial differentiation.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring the definitions and relationships between the coefficients involved. Some guidance has been offered regarding the need to clarify defining equations for the coefficients, which may help in addressing the original poster's confusion.

Contextual Notes

There is an indication that the original poster may be struggling with the notation and conceptual understanding of partial derivatives in thermodynamics, particularly regarding the assumptions made during differentiation.

Nikitin
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Homework Statement


In oppgave 1 a) I am supposed to show that the given equality is true (namely that the isoterm compressibility coefficient partial-differentiated with regards to temperature = isobar coefficient differentiated with regards to pressure multiplied by minus one).

http://web.phys.ntnu.no/~stovneng/TFY4165_2014/oving2.pdf

The Attempt at a Solution

I can naturally see that the way to attack this problem is to simply carry out the differentiations, but how does it make sense to partially differentiate ##\alpha_V## with regards to ##p## when ##\alpha_V## assumes constant pressure? And besides, ##\alpha_V## measures the change of relative volume as a function of ##T##, yet constant temperature is assumed for ##\frac{\partial \alpha_V}{\partial p}##? It's a similar problem with the differentiating the isoterm coefficient with regards to temperature while keeping pressure constant..
 
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Not strong in Norwegian. alpha_v may be defined at constant pressure, that doesn't mean its value is independent of the pressure!
 
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Okay, but alpha_v is the change of relative volume with regards to temperature, yet ##\frac{\partial \alpha_V}{\partial p}## assumes constant temperature? How does it make sense to calculate how ##\alpha_V## (which is a measure of how the volume varies with regards to temperature) varies while the temperature is constant?
 
##\alpha_V## is a function of both temperature and pressure. Unfortunately, many, if not most, texts on thermodynamics do a very bad job at explaining functional dependencies among all the things they operate with. The unconventional notation ##\left({\partial X \over \partial Y}\right)_{Z}## is my personal anti-favorite, because in my experience very few students understand what it really signifies. Just for the record, it means that ##X## is considered to be a function of ##Y## and ##Z##, and is differentiated with respect to ##Y##. The usually added bit that ##Z## is held constant is redundant because that follows from the definition of partial differentiation. I suspect it is not only redundant, but is severely confusing, because the obvious redundancy makes the inexperienced reader wonder what really is going on.
 
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Please write down your defining equations for αV and κT. Once you get a look at these, you will see immediately how to prove what you are trying to prove.
 

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