Energy Loss From Permanent Magnets

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the energy dynamics involved when a permanent magnet attracts an object, particularly focusing on whether the magnet loses energy during this process and if any energy is transferred back to the magnet when the object is removed. The scope includes conceptual reasoning and exploratory questioning regarding the nature of magnetic fields and energy transfer.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that when a permanent magnet attracts an object, it does work and loses energy, questioning if the magnetic field is rejuvenated when the object is pulled away.
  • Another participant argues that the force from a magnet does not require an expenditure of energy, likening it to gravitational forces and suggesting that potential energy is converted to kinetic energy upon attraction.
  • A different participant asserts that the magnet does work on the door as it moves through a distance, implying that the energy to do this must come from the magnet.
  • Another viewpoint states that the energy does not come from the magnet itself, but rather that the magnetic field energy changes during the interaction.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the source of energy during the interaction between the magnet and the object. There is no consensus on whether the magnet loses energy or if the energy dynamics are solely related to changes in the magnetic field.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference concepts of potential and kinetic energy, but there are unresolved assumptions regarding the nature of energy transfer and the mechanics of magnetic fields. The discussion does not clarify the mathematical relationships involved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring concepts in electromagnetism, energy transfer in physical systems, and the mechanics of forces in physics.

Eugbug
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Here's a question I posted about 10 years ago as a member of the forum. No one seemed to provide a satisfactory answer then so maybe someone might have some ideas on the subject:

When a permanent magnet attracts an object it does work and loses energy.
When the object is pulled away is the magnetic field rejuvenated to some extent and energy transferred back to the magnet?
I often wondered about this because the magnetic catches on cupboard doors never seem to wear out which would happen if all the magnetic potential energy was used up.
The magnet is in a fixed position and exerts a force on the piece of metal on the door. The door is accelerated by the force so it gains kinetic energy and the only source of energy in the system is from the magnetic field of the magnet.
There must be energy transfer from the magnet in order to accelerate the door and give it kinetic energy.

This is the conversation in the forum from then:

http://physicspost.com/physicsforums/topic.asp-ARCHIVE=&TOPIC_ID=4161.htm
 
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The force from a magnet does not require an expenditure of energy to function. In a similar way, gravity doesn't require it either. Note that you cannot get repeatable work from a permanent magnet if all you are doing is allowing an object to be attracted to it in such a manner.

Edit: I don't know for sure, but it would appear to me to be similar to potential energy related to gravity. The potential energy is converted to kinetic and then lost when the object impacts the magnet. But again, I'm not sure.
 
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When the door is moved close to the magnet and is let go, the magnet does work as it moves the mass of the door through a distance. That is the definition of work. The energy to do this must come from the magnet.
Presumably the same thing would happen if a distant object is moved into the influence of Earths gravity. The gravitational force would attract the body giving it velocity and kinetic energy. On impact, some of energy would be dissipated as heat.
 
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The energy does not come from the magnet. The magnetic field energy changes.
It is the same when when a proton attracts an electron, the field energy changes, but not the proton.
 

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