Euler-Lagrange equation: pulley system

AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around applying the Euler-Lagrange equation to a pulley system involving two masses, m_A and m_B, with given values. The Lagrangian is derived from the kinetic and potential energy, leading to the equation for acceleration, which the user initially calculates as 1.9604 m/s², while the expected answer is 1.78 m/s². Confusion arises regarding the relationship between the heights of the two masses, y_A and y_B, particularly the equation y_A + y_B = c, which is questioned for its validity. Participants suggest expressing the total length of the string in terms of y_A and y_B to clarify the setup. The user expresses frustration over the complexity of the problem but seeks guidance on correctly formulating the relationships involved.
bookworm031
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Homework Statement
Determine, using Euler-Lagrange's equation, the acceleration for B when the weights are moving vertically.
Relevant Equations
##\frac{d}{dt}\bigg(\frac{\partial L}{\partial \dot{y}}\bigg) = \frac{\partial L}{\partial y}##, ##L = T - V##
atwood.png


##m_{A} = 3 kg##
##m_{B} = 2 kg##

##y_{A} + y_{B} = c \Leftrightarrow y_{A} = c - y_{B}##, where c is a constant.
##\Rightarrow \dot{y_{A}} = -\dot{y_{B}}##

The Lagrangian:
$$L = T - V$$
##T =\frac{1}{2}m_{A}\dot{y_{B}}^{2} + \frac{1}{2}m_{B}\dot{y_{B}}^{2}##
##V = m_{A}g(c - y_{B}) + m_{B}gy_{B}##
##\Leftrightarrow L = \frac{1}{2}m_{A}\dot{y_{B}}^{2} + \frac{1}{2}m_{B}\dot{y_{B}}^{2} - (m_{A}g(c - y_{B}) + m_{B}gy_{B})##

Applying Euler-Lagrange's equation:

##\frac{d}{dt}\bigg(\frac{\partial L}{\partial \dot{y}}\bigg) = \ddot{y_{B}}(m_{B} + m_{A})##
##\frac{\partial L}{\partial y} = g(m_{A} - m_{B})##

Solving for ##\ddot{y_{B}}##:
##\ddot{y_{B}} = \frac{g(m_{A} - m_{B})}{(m_{B} + m_{A})} = 1.9604 \frac{m}{s^{2}}##

The answer is supposed to be ##1.78 \frac{m}{s^{2}}##. What am I doing wrong? I'm completely lost.

Thanks!
 
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bookworm031 said:
##y_{A} + y_{B} = c ##, where c is a constant.
Sure?
 
haruspex said:
Sure?
No. However, the rationale was that, since one weight moves down as the other moves up, and vice versa, the difference should always be a constant. Do you think this is wrong? If so, what's the relationship between ##y_{A}## and ##y_{B}##?

Edit: Now that I think about it, ##y_{A} + y_{B} = c## doesn't make much sense, though I'm still not sure how to set up a relationship.
 
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bookworm031 said:
No. However, the rationale was that, since one weight moves down as the other moves up, and vice versa, the difference should always be a constant. Do you think this is wrong? If so, what's the relationship between ##y_{A}## and ##y_{B}##?

Edit: Now that I think about it, ##y_{A} + y_{B} = c## doesn't make much sense, though I'm still not sure how to set up a relationship.
Express the total length of the string in terms of the three straight parts. Don't worry about the semicircular arcs since those are constant.
 
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haruspex said:
Express the total length of the string in terms of the three straight parts. Don't worry about the semicircular arcs since those are constant.
I don't know why I find this so difficult, I feel very stupid right now. I should express the total length only in terms of ##y_{A}## and ##y_{B}##, right? I've been staring myself blind at this figure.
 
bookworm031 said:
I don't know why I find this so difficult, I feel very stupid right now. I should express the total length only in terms of ##y_{A}## and ##y_{B}##, right? I've been staring myself blind at this figure.
Let the lengths of the string sections, numbered from the left, be L1, L2, L3.
Allow also a constant Lf for the short fixed string supporting the upper pulley.
What equations can you write relating these to ##y_{A}## and ##y_{B}##?
Can you then find L1+L2+L3 in terms of ##y_{A}##, ##y_{B}, L_f##?
 
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