Feynman propagator for a simple harmonic oscillator

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Feynman propagator for a quantum simple harmonic oscillator, particularly in the context of the derivation presented in Lancaster & Blundell's Quantum Field Theory for the Gifted Amateur. Participants explore the relationship between the propagator for a scalar field and that for the harmonic oscillator, addressing specific exercises and derivations from the text.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant discusses the derivation of the Feynman propagator for a scalar field and attempts to apply it to the harmonic oscillator, questioning the appearance of an extra factor of ##m## in the denominator of the propagator.
  • Another participant references a German source for the propagator of the harmonic oscillator, indicating uncertainty about the derivation presented in the book.
  • A participant expresses confusion about how to apply the methods from the book to the harmonic oscillator, suggesting that the derivation for free Klein-Gordon fields may not directly apply.
  • One participant proposes that if the expansion of the field is valid for the harmonic oscillator, then the derivation should yield the expected result without the extra factor of ##m##.
  • Another participant provides a detailed explanation of the creation and annihilation operators for the harmonic oscillator and discusses the implications for the Hamiltonian and eigenstates.
  • Participants engage in a technical discussion about the time-ordered Green's function and its relation to the propagator, noting differences in definitions between sources.
  • There is a mention of the importance of auto-correlation functions in quantum field theory, with a participant suggesting that the exercise serves as a mathematical exercise rather than a practical application.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the derivation of the propagator for the harmonic oscillator, with no clear consensus on the correct form or the source of the extra factor of ##m##. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the relationship between the propagators and the methods used in the derivation.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note that the derivation methods for the Klein-Gordon field may not directly translate to the harmonic oscillator, indicating potential limitations in the assumptions made during the discussion.

Glenn Rowe
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I'm reading through Lancaster & Blundell's Quantum Field Theory for the Gifted Amateur and have got to Chapter 17 on calculating propagataors. In their equation 17.23 they derive the expression for the free Feynman propagator for a scalar field to be $$\Delta\left(x,y\right)=\int\frac{d^{4}p}{\left(2\pi\right)^{4}}e^{-ip\cdot\left(x-y\right)}\frac{i}{\left(p^{0}\right)^{2}-E_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{2}+i\epsilon}$$ where ##p^0=E## represents an energy that is not on the mass shell, so that in general ##p^{0}\ne\sqrt{E_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{2}+m^{2}}##. I'm able to follow their derivation (I think), but then in Exercise 17.4, they ask us to show that the Feynman propagator for the quantum simple harmonic oscillator with spring constant ##m\omega_{0}^{2}## is given by $$\tilde{G}\left(\omega\right)=\frac{i}{m\left(\omega^{2}-\omega_{0}^{2}+i\epsilon\right)}$$
It seems to me that the energy of the harmonic oscillator in its "one-particle" state is ##\omega_0##, and the general energy (off the mass shell) is given by ##\omega## so that the position-space propagator would be given by $$G\left(x,y\right)=\int\frac{d^{4}p}{\left(2\pi\right)^{4}}e^{-ip\cdot\left(x-y\right)}\frac{i}{\omega^{2}-\omega_{0}^{2}+i\epsilon}$$
From there, we can read off the momentum-space Fourier component as $$\tilde{G}\left(\omega\right)=\frac{i}{\left(\omega^{2}-\omega_{0}^{2}+i\epsilon\right)}$$
I can't figure out where the extra factor of ##m## in the denominator comes from. Introducing the extra ##m## seems to mess up the units as well, since their general expression for the momentum-space propagator is $$\tilde{\Delta}\left(p\right)=\frac{i}{\left(p^{0}\right)^{2}-E_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{2}+i\epsilon}$$. I'm guessing I'm missing something simple (since pretty well all the exercises in the book aren't too complex once you understand the principles), but I just can't see it.
 
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I've seen a derivation similar to that somewhere else (in English as well, I think) but I don't think that's what Lancaster & Blundell have in mind, since it doesn't give the answer they ask us to prove.

I have to admit I don't understand how you would introduce the harmonic oscillator into the methods they describe in their chapter 17, since their derivation is be done for free Klein-Gordon fields, which I don't think are the same as harmonic oscillators.

Maybe a better question is: is the expansion of the field $$\phi\left(x\right)=\frac{1}{\left(2\pi\right)^{3/2}}\int\frac{d^{3}p}{\left(2\omega\right)^{1/2}}\left(a_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{\dagger}e^{ip\cdot x}+a_{\boldsymbol{p}}e^{-ip\cdot x}\right)$$ valid for a harmonic oscillator, where ##a_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{\dagger}## and ##a_{\boldsymbol{p}}## are the creation and annihilation operators for the harmonic oscillator? If so, does ##a_{\boldsymbol{p}}^{\dagger}\left|0\right\rangle =\left|\boldsymbol{p}\right\rangle## where ##\left|\boldsymbol{p}\right\rangle## represents a single oscillator with momentum p?
If all that is true, then it would seem that the rest of their derivation would follow in the same way for a harmonic oscillator which would give the result $$\tilde{G}\left(\omega\right)=\frac{i}{\left(\omega^{2}-\omega_{0}^{2}+i\epsilon\right)}$$ that I got originally (without the extra ##m## in the denominator).

What makes me wonder if their answer is correct is that I've seen the derivation of the German result several times, but I've never seen anyone give Lancaster & Blundell's answer anywhere.
 
Never mind - I figured it out and have posted my solution https://physicspages.com/pdf/Lancaster%20QFT/Lancaster%20Problems%2017.04.pdf. However, It requires using the technique developed in the previous exercise 17.3, although I have to say I'm not sure why that method works, but anyway.
 
For the harmonic oscillator you can of course define creation and annihilation operators. These always refer to a basis. In this case it's the energy eigenbasis. For the 1D harmonic oscillator that's all you need to define a complete orthonormal basis. You can define the normal-ordered Hamiltonian setting the arbitrary value for the ground-state energy to 0. Then you have
$$\hat{H}=\omega \hat{a}^{\dagger} \hat{a}=\omega \hat{N}.$$
The eigenvalues of ##\hat{N}## are ##n \in \{0,1,2,\ldots \}##. The ground state is defined by
$$\hat{a} |\Omega \rangle=0,$$
and the eigenstates with eigenvalue ##n## are
$$|n \rangle=\frac{1}{\sqrt{n!}} (\hat{a}^{\dagger})^n |\Omega \rangle.$$
All this can be algebraically derived from the commutator
$$[\hat{a},\hat{a}^{\dagger}]=\hat{1} .$$
That given you can reconstruct the position and momentum operators as appropriate linear Hermitean linear combinations:
$$\hat{x}=A \hat{a} + A^* \hat{a}^{\dagger}, \quad \hat{p}=\mathrm{i} (B \hat{a}-B^* \hat{a}^{\dagger}).$$
To get the Heisenberg algebra you need
$$[\hat{x},\hat{p}]=\mathrm{i} \hat{1},$$
but now
$$[\hat{x},\hat{p}] = \mathrm{i} [A \hat{a} + A^* \hat{a}^{\dagger},B \hat{a}-B^* \hat{a}^{\dagger}] = \mathrm{i} (A B^* + A^* B) \hat{1}\; \Rightarrow \; A B^* + A^*B=2 \mathrm{Re}(A B^*) \stackrel{!}{=}1.$$
The usual choice is ##A,B \in \mathrm{R}##

$$\hat{x}=\sqrt{\frac{1}{2m\omega}}(\hat{a}+\hat{a}^{\dagger}), \quad \hat{p}=\mathrm{i} \sqrt{\frac{m \omega}{2}} (\hat{a}^{\dagger}-\hat{a}).$$
In analogy to the field-theory case you simply have in the Heisenberg picture (!)
$$\hat{x}_H(t)=\sqrt{\frac{1}{2 m \omega}} [\hat{a} \exp(-\mathrm{i} \omega t)+\hat{a}^{\dagger} \exp(\mathrm{i} \omega t)].$$
It's easy to check that ##\hat{p}_H(t)=m \dot{\hat{x}}##.

I have assumed that Heisenberg and Schrödinger picture coincide at time ##t=0##.

I can only guess what the exercise may be asking. It's perhaps to calculate the time-ordered vacuum time-ordered Green's function
$$G(t)=-\mathrm{i} \langle \Omega |\mathcal{T} \hat{x}_H(t) \hat{x}(0)|\Omega \rangle$$
or its Fouier transform [corrected in view of #6]
$$\tilde{G}(k_0)=\int_{\mathbb{R}} \mathrm{d} t \exp(\mathrm{i} k_0 t) G(t).$$
This is of course a propagator for the classical-mechanics equation of motion,
$$-m \ddot{G}(t)- m (\omega^2- \mathrm{i} 0^+) G(t) = \delta(t).$$
The Fourier transform thus obeys
$$m (k_0^2-\omega^2+\mathrm{i} 0^+) \tilde{G}(\omega)=1.$$
Obviously your book has a slightly different definition of the Green's function. Obviously
$$G_{\text{book}}=\mathrm{i} G.$$
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the explanation. I'm assuming you left out a factor of ##G(t)## in the integrand of ##\tilde{G}(k_0)##?
 
Argh. Of course, I'll edit it in the original posting.
 
vanhees71 said:
G(t)=−i⟨Ω|T^xH(t)^x(0)|Ω⟩

Just curious, is this a useful quantity for anything?
 
I'd rather say it's a nice mathematical exercise in introductory QFT boiling it down to the simple harmonic oscillators. In QFT the various "auto-correlation functions" are very important for calculations. They are called Green's functions.
 
  • #10
Glenn Rowe said:
Thanks for the explanation. I'm assuming you left out a factor of ##G(t)## in the integrand of ##\tilde{G}(k_0)##?
Can u reupload your solution or post it here pls?, I'm having the same issue
 

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