Find Perfect Square $m,n \in N$ with $m^2-4n$ & $n^2-4m$

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding natural numbers \(m\) and \(n\) such that both \(m^2 - 4n\) and \(n^2 - 4m\) are perfect squares. The scope includes mathematical reasoning and exploration of conditions that may apply to \(m\) and \(n\).

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that there should be restrictions on \(m\) and \(n\), such as \(m > n\).
  • One participant notes that if negative integers were allowed, there would be infinite solutions, proposing a relationship between \(m\) and \(n\) as \(m = x\) and \(n = -(x + 1)\).
  • Another participant points out a flaw in the original question, indicating that \(m^2 - 4n\) and \(n^2 - 4m\) should be treated together rather than separately.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conditions that should apply to \(m\) and \(n\), and there is no consensus on how to approach the problem or the implications of allowing negative integers.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions about the nature of \(m\) and \(n\), particularly concerning their being natural numbers and the implications of allowing negative integers.

Albert1
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$m,n \in N$
if $m^2-4n ,\,\, and \,\, n^2-4m$ are all perfect square numbers , please find all $m$ and $n$
 
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Should you not have some restrictions, like m > n?
Asking because these are 3 of the solutions:
m = 4, n = 4
m = 6, n = 5
m = 5, n = 6
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Wilmer said:
Should you not have some restrictions, like m > n?
Asking because these are 3 of the solutions:
m = 4, n = 4
m = 6, n = 5
m = 5, n = 6
your answers are corret,please state with reason
 
without loss of generality we can assume m >=n. if(m,n) is a solution then (n,m) is another
now 4n is even so $m^2 - 4n <= (m-2)^2$
or $-4n<=-4m + 4$
or $n >=m-1$

case 1)
$m=n$
then $m^2 -4m = m(m-4)$ is perfect square = $(k+2)(k-2)$ taking $k = m-2$

$(k+2)(k-2) = k^2 - 4 = p^2(say)$
$(k+p)(k-p) = 4$ so $k+ p = k- p = 2$ as both are even or both odd
so $k = 2, p = 0$ or $m = 4$
so solution $m=n= 4$

case 2)
$n >=m-1$
or $n = m- 1$
now $m^2- 4n = m^2-4(m-1) = (m-2)^2$ always whole square
check the other one
$n^2 - 4m = n^2 - 4(n+1) = n^2 - 4n - 4 = (n-2)^2 + 8 = q^2(say)$

or $(n+2)^2-q^2 = 8$ giving $n-2 + q =4$ and $n-2-q=2$ as both are even
solving $n= 5$ and as $m = n+1$ we have (m,n) = (6,5)
by symmetry (m,n) = (5,6)

combining both we have (m,n) = (6,5) or (5,6) or (4,4)
 
Albert said:
your answers are correct,please state with reason
Sorry. Was intending to ask question only...gave those as examples.

Didn't realize negative integers were not allowed.
If they were, then there's infinite solutions:
if m = x then n = -(x + 1)
 
Wilmer said:
Sorry. Was intending to ask question only...gave those as examples.

Didn't realize negative integers were not allowed.
If they were, then there's infinite solutions:
if m = x then n = -(x + 1)
yes this original qustion has a flaw:
here we treat $m^2-4n , and \, n^2-4m $ separately
 

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