First order perturbation derivation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of first order perturbation theory in quantum mechanics, specifically focusing on the cancellation of terms involving the Hermitian operator \(\hat{H}_0\) and the unperturbed energy \(E_0\). Participants explore the implications of Hermitian operators in this context and clarify notational conventions related to bra-ket notation.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the cancellation in first order perturbation is due to the equality \(\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle = E_0 \langle \psi_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle\), linking it to the properties of Hermitian operators.
  • Another participant questions the notational correctness of placing the operator \(\hat{H}_0\) outside the bra-ket notation, seeking clarification on whether this is acceptable or not.
  • A response emphasizes that the strict approach is to keep operators within the bra or ket, highlighting the ambiguity in the expression \(\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle\) and noting that many texts may not adhere strictly to this convention.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the notational conventions of bra-ket notation, with some advocating for strict adherence while others suggest that context often clarifies meaning. The discussion on the properties of Hermitian operators appears to be more aligned, but no consensus is reached on the notational issue.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the properties of Hermitian operators and the implications for perturbation theory, as well as the ambiguity inherent in bra-ket notation. These aspects remain unresolved and are subject to interpretation based on context.

spacetimedude
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In lectures, I learned that in first order perturbation, \hat{H}_0 term cancels with E_0 term because \hat{H}_0 is Hermitian. What property does Hermitian operators hold that cancels with the unperturbed energy?
 
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spacetimedude said:
In lectures

Can you give an online reference to the lectures? Or at least information about what lectures (which school, which class, which textbook are you using, etc.)?
 
PeterDonis said:
Can you give an online reference to the lectures? Or at least information about what lectures (which school, which class, which textbook are you using, etc.)?
http://www2.ph.ed.ac.uk/~ldeldebb/docs/QM/lect17.pdf
I am not sure if you can access the page but it is on the third page of the notes.
 
Ok, so the cancellation in question is due to the equality:

$$
\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle = E_0 \langle \psi_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle
$$

Since ##\psi_0## is an eigenfunction of ##\hat{H}_0##, we know that ##\hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_0 \rangle = E_0 \vert \psi_0 \rangle##. But the fact that ##\hat{H}_0## is Hermitian let's us flip this around so that ##\hat{H}_0## operates to the left instead of to the right, i.e., we have ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 = E_0 \langle \psi_0 \vert##. And that is exactly what we need in order for the equality above, that justifies the cancellation in the first-order equation, to hold.
 
PeterDonis said:
Ok, so the cancellation in question is due to the equality:

$$
\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle = E_0 \langle \psi_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle
$$

Since ##\psi_0## is an eigenfunction of ##\hat{H}_0##, we know that ##\hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_0 \rangle = E_0 \vert \psi_0 \rangle##. But the fact that ##\hat{H}_0## is Hermitian let's us flip this around so that ##\hat{H}_0## operates to the left instead of to the right, i.e., we have ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 = E_0 \langle \psi_0 \vert##. And that is exactly what we need in order for the equality above, that justifies the cancellation in the first-order equation, to hold.
I see. Is it okay to think that the ##\hat{H}_0## is outside of the bra-ket or is it notationally wrong and operators always have to be kept inside?
 
spacetimedude said:
Is it okay to think that the ##\hat{H}_0## is outside of the bra-ket or is it notationally wrong and operators always have to be kept inside?

The strict way to do it is to always keep the operators inside either the bra or the ket. In other words, the expression ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle## is formally ambiguous; it could mean either ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \psi_1 \rangle##, where the operator is applied to the vector on the right, or ##\langle \hat{H}_0 \psi_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle##, where the operator is applied to the vector on the left. However, many texts are not this strict and write the operator between the bra and the ket, leaving it to context to show which operation is meant--or relying on the fact that in many cases, such as the one under discussion, it doesn't matter.
 
PeterDonis said:
The strict way to do it is to always keep the operators inside either the bra or the ket. In other words, the expression ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle## is formally ambiguous; it could mean either ##\langle \psi_0 \vert \hat{H}_0 \psi_1 \rangle##, where the operator is applied to the vector on the right, or ##\langle \hat{H}_0 \psi_0 \vert \psi_1 \rangle##, where the operator is applied to the vector on the left. However, many texts are not this strict and write the operator between the bra and the ket, leaving it to context to show which operation is meant--or relying on the fact that in many cases, such as the one under discussion, it doesn't matter.
Thank you very much!
 

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