Gibbs free energy doesn't increase (constant T and P) - proof doesn't seem right

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the proof that Gibbs free energy (G) does not increase during isothermal transformations at constant temperature and pressure. It establishes that for such systems, the relationship ΔG = ΔF + Δ(PV) leads to the conclusion that ΔG ≤ 0. However, a critical examination reveals a contradiction in the assumption that ΔW ≤ -ΔF when ΔW is shown to be greater than or equal to ΔF. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding the relationship between work (W), Helmholtz free energy (F), and Gibbs free energy (G) in thermodynamic processes.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of thermodynamic concepts, specifically isothermal transformations.
  • Familiarity with Helmholtz Free Energy (F = E - TS) and Gibbs Free Energy (G = F + PV).
  • Knowledge of the first and second laws of thermodynamics.
  • Basic calculus, particularly in the context of differential forms in thermodynamics.
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation of the relationship between Helmholtz and Gibbs free energy in isothermal processes.
  • Explore the implications of the second law of thermodynamics on Gibbs free energy.
  • Learn about the role of entropy in thermodynamic systems and its relationship to free energy.
  • Investigate the conditions under which work (W) is defined in thermodynamic transformations.
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for students and professionals in thermodynamics, particularly those studying physical chemistry, chemical engineering, and related fields. It is also relevant for researchers exploring the principles of energy transformations in systems at constant temperature and pressure.

Silversonic
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First my notes discover that for an isothermal transformation;

ΔW ≥ ΔF

Where W is the work done and F is the Helmholtz Free Energy, F = E - TS.


Then it defines the Gibbs free Energy;

G = F + PV

"For a system at constant temperature and pressure, G never increases";

So ΔG = ΔF + Δ(PV) = ΔF + PΔV = ΔF + ΔW


Then it says "We already know ΔW ≤ -ΔF and therefore ΔW + ΔF = ΔG ≤ 0".

But how can we assume ΔW ≤ -ΔF from the fact that ΔW ≥ ΔF? If ΔW is positive and |ΔW| ≥ |ΔF| then this assumption does not work, and also I have nothing that indicates to me the change in the work done is either positive or negative. I can't seem to show how this proof was meant to work otherwise though, any help?
 
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Silversonic said:
First my notes discover that for an isothermal transformation;

ΔW ≥ ΔF

Where W is the work done and F is the Helmholtz Free Energy, F = E - TS.


Then it defines the Gibbs free Energy;

G = F + PV

"For a system at constant temperature and pressure, G never increases";

So ΔG = ΔF + Δ(PV) = ΔF + PΔV = ΔF + ΔW


Then it says "We already know ΔW ≤ -ΔF and therefore ΔW + ΔF = ΔG ≤ 0".

But how can we assume ΔW ≤ -ΔF from the fact that ΔW ≥ ΔF? If ΔW is positive and |ΔW| ≥ |ΔF| then this assumption does not work, and also I have nothing that indicates to me the change in the work done is either positive or negative. I can't seem to show how this proof was meant to work otherwise though, any help?



From what I can see...

dW = -PdV + \mu dN
dE = dW + dQ = dW + T dS

At constant temperature...

d F = d E - T dS = dW
so
ΔF = ΔW.

I would be interested in knowing how you show
ΔF ≤ ΔW



Also, there is an interesting way (which may be along the same lines as your notes) to show that the Gibbs free energy never increases in processes at constant temperature and pressure.

We note that in all processes where a system is in contact with a pressure and temperature reservoir, the system will evolve toward a state which maximizes the entropy of both system plus reservoir.

dS^{s+r} = dS^{s} + dS^{r} ≥0
dS^{s} = (1/T^{s})*(dU^{s} + P^{s} dV^{s} - \mu^{s} dN^{s})

With these two expressions and knowing that the temperature and pressure are the same for both system and reservoir, you can show that
dS^{s+r} = -(1/T^{s})*dG^{s}
so that since the system inexorably tends to maximize the entropy of the universe (universe = system plus reservoir), it must also inexorably tend to minimize its Gibbs free energy for processes at constant temperature and pressure.

Anywhoo, that's why I'd say the Gibbs free energy of the system cannot increase for processes at constant temperature and pressure.

-James
 

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