Graph function of f(x) with max/min. Don't know what the problem is.

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the function f(x) = a − b cos x, where a and b are positive constants, and the task is to sketch the graph of this function given its maximum and minimum values. Participants are exploring the implications of these values and how they relate to the constants a and b.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to determine the values of a and b based on the maximum and minimum values of the function. There is confusion regarding the sign of b, as it was stated that both constants should be positive. Some participants are questioning the assumptions made about the behavior of the cosine function and its impact on the values of a and b.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the relationships between the constants a and b and the function's maximum and minimum values. Some participants have provided insights into the reasoning behind their calculations, while others are seeking clarification on the logic used in these calculations. No consensus has been reached regarding the correct values of a and b.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the constraints that a and b must be positive constants, while the calculations suggest otherwise. There is also mention of attachments that some participants cannot view, which may hinder the discussion.

SolCon
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Hi to all. :)

So I'm having a problem with this question, but in only one part, whereas the other parts of this question were done with correct answers. The only part where I'm having a problem, concerns drawing the graph of y=f(x). Here's the question:

Q. The function f is such that f(x) = a − b cos x for 0◦ ≤ x ≤ 360◦, where a and b are positive constants. The maximum value of f(x) is 10 and the minimum value is −2.

This came in parts (i) and (ii), both of which were done:

(i) Find the values of a and b.
Ans : a=4, b=-6

(ii) Solve the equation f(x) = 0.
Ans: x=131.8◦

(iii) Sketch the graph of y = f(x).
This is where I have a problem.

Here's how I tabulated the function:

http://usera.ImageCave.com/biosyn/grp%201.PNG

And here's the resulting graph:

http://usera.ImageCave.com/biosyn/grp%202.PNG

This seems to be wrong. However, I don't really know what the problem is and this is all I keep getting. :(
 
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Hi SolCon! :smile:
SolCon said:
And here's the resulting graph:

Looks ok, except

what happened to 3π/2 ? :wink:
 
I can't see the attachments. Also,

SolCon said:
Hi to all. :)
(i) Find the values of a and b.
Ans : a=4, b=-6
Why is b negative, when you stated before that a and b are positive constants?
 
The largest possible value for cos(x) is 1 so the smallest possible value for a- bcos(x) is a- b= -2. The smallest possible value for cos(X) is -1 so the largest possible value for a- bcos(x) is a+ b= 10.

Solve a- b= -2, a+ b= 10 for a and b.
 
Apologies for the late reply.

Thanks everyone for the responses. :)

tiny-tim: Yes, I forgot about that. Was going by doubling the pi value. :)

eumyang: I don't know why you can't see the images, maybe something's blocking them at your end? Also, the part where the question asks for a positive b constant and me getting a -ve one is probably the part I'm having difficulty with.

HallsofIvy: I don't understand what you've done. Here's how I did it:

I agree with you about the fact that the greatest value of cos(x) is 1 [cos(0)]. So I did it like this:

> a-b cosx = f(x)
> a-b cos(0) = 10 [cos(0) = 10, i.e, greatest value]
> a-b(1) = 10
> a-b=10

The same with the least value of cos(x) which is -1 [cos(180)].

> a-b cos(180) = -2 [cos(180) = -2, i.e, lowest value]
> a-b(-1) = -2
> a+b = -2

This is how I got them and solved them simultaneously then. How come they not correct? :(
 
All I can say is that a= 4, b= -6 are the only values of a and b that will make a- bcos(x) have a maximum value of 10 and a minimum value of -2. There are not positive values that will work.
 
SolCon said:
Apologies for the late reply.

Thanks everyone for the responses. :)

tiny-tim: Yes, I forgot about that. Was going by doubling the pi value. :)

eumyang: I don't know why you can't see the images, maybe something's blocking them at your end? Also, the part where the question asks for a positive b constant and me getting a -ve one is probably the part I'm having difficulty with.

HallsofIvy: I don't understand what you've done. Here's how I did it:

I agree with you about the fact that the greatest value of cos(x) is 1 [cos(0)]. So I did it like this:

> a-b cosx = f(x)
> a-b cos(0) = 10 [cos(0) = 10, i.e, greatest value]
> a-b(1) = 10
> a-b=10

The same with the least value of cos(x) which is -1 [cos(180)].

> a-b cos(180) = -2 [cos(180) = -2, i.e, lowest value]
> a-b(-1) = -2
> a+b = -2

This is how I got them and solved them simultaneously then. How come they not correct? :(
You did almost what I did except: subtracting a larger number gives you a smaller number! While 1 is the largest value of cos(x), it does NOT give the largest value of a- bcos(x), it gives the smallest.

A more formal way of seeing that is: cos(x)\le 1 for all x so, multiplying both sides of that by -b, -bcos(x)\ge -b (remember that the inequality sign switches direction when you multiply both sides by a negative number) and then, adding a to both sides, a- bcos(x)\ge a- b. Since a- b is always less than or equal to a- bcos(x), it is the minimum value, not the maximum: a- b= -2, not 10.


Similarly, because cos(x)\ge -1, -bcos(x)\le b and a- bcos(x)\le a+ b. Since a- bcos(x) is always less than or equal to a+ b, a+ b is its maximum value, 10.

Now solve a- b= -2, a+ b= 10.
 
Once I again I thank you for the well structured explanation. It'll take me a while to completely allow the entire thing to penetrate through my skull, but I'm sure I'll get it.

Thanks for the help. :)
 

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