How Can I Prove This Second Order Derivative Equation in Trigonometry?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving a second order derivative equation in trigonometry, specifically involving the expressions for x and y in terms of theta. Participants explore various methods and strategies for proving the equation without reaching a consensus.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses frustration with the problem and shares their initial calculations for derivatives, questioning if they are misapplying trigonometric functions.
  • Another participant suggests using trigonometric identities to simplify the problem, implying that the solution is straightforward.
  • A third participant criticizes the clarity of the original post and reiterates the need for trigonometric identities, suggesting that the problem is not complex.
  • One participant proposes a method involving complex exponentials to manipulate the expressions, detailing a step-by-step approach but acknowledges that it may be lengthy and confusing for complex trigonometric expressions.
  • A later reply appreciates the proposed method but requests a simpler approach, indicating that the complexity of the method may not be suitable for the original problem.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to prove the equation. There are competing views on the methods to be used, with some advocating for trigonometric identities and others suggesting more complex strategies.

Contextual Notes

Participants do not verify each other's calculations, and there is an underlying uncertainty regarding the correctness of the initial differentiation and algebraic manipulations. The discussion reflects various assumptions about the methods and their applicability to the problem at hand.

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Been doing calculus all my life , that's why i am at the Indian Institute of Technology:shy:..
but never faced a headache like this...

Prove that:

If x=cos theta and y = sin^3 theta

then [d^2y/dx^2] + [dy/dx]^2 = 3sin^2 theta [ 5 cos ^2 theta -1 ]

My side:

dx/d theta = -sin theta
dy/d theta = 3 sin^2 theta cos theta
>> {dy/dx}== -3 sin theta cos theta

now d^2y/dx^2= -3 [ cos^2 theta - sin ^2 theta ]* 1/-sin theta

moving with the give expression...

3cos^2 theta-3 sin^2 theta/sin theta + 9 sin^2 theta cos^2 theta

Spent a lot of time...cud not get anywhere...
Am i messing up the trigo functions?:frown:

This is not a homework question. I don't have to do homework anymore.I work in a MNC.
 
Last edited:
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You've never faced a "headache" like that? Use trig identities.
 
Please be a bit more clear.Even a moron knows that you got to use trigo identities.Its no rocket science!
 
Ok, I'm going to assume you didn't make any algebra/differentiation mistakes so far (I didn't check)
If that is the case, then you are starting here:
3cos^2 theta-3 sin^2 theta/sin theta + 9 sin^2 theta cos^2 theta

And you want to get here:
3sin^2 theta [ 5 cos ^2 theta -1 ]

I would write each expression in terms of complex exponentials, then multiply all the exponentials out completely, working both backwards and forwards simultaneously. Then when your results meet in the middle, rearrange your steps to go from where you started to where you finished.

Here is a small (easier) example of this strategy in action: Say we want to show [itex]cos^2\left(x\right) = 1-sin^2\left(x\right)[/tex]<br /> Working forwards:<br /> [tex]cos^2\left(x\right)=\left(\frac{e^{i x}+e^{-i x}}{2}\right)^2=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}[/tex] <br /> Now hold that thought while we work backwards...<br /> <br /> Working backwards:<br /> [tex]1-sin^2\left(x\right) = 1-\left(\frac{e^{i x}-e^{-i x}}{2 i}\right)^2=1-\frac{e^{2 i x}-2+e^{-2 i x}}{-4}=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}[/tex]<br /> <br /> Then to write the final proof, you would just rearrange the steps:<br /> [tex]cos^2\left(x\right)=\left(\frac{e^{i x}+e^{-i x}}{2}\right)^2=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}=1-\frac{e^{2 i x}-2+e^{-2 i x}}{-4}=1-\left(\frac{e^{i x}-e^{-i x}}{2 i}\right)^2=1-sin^2\left(x\right)[/tex][/itex]
 
Last edited:
maze said:
Ok, I'm going to assume you didn't make any algebra/differentiation mistakes so far (I didn't check)
If that is the case, then you are starting here:
3cos^2 theta-3 sin^2 theta/sin theta + 9 sin^2 theta cos^2 theta

And you want to get here:
3sin^2 theta [ 5 cos ^2 theta -1 ]

I would write each expression in terms of complex exponentials, then multiply all the exponentials out completely, working both backwards and forwards simultaneously. Then when your results meet in the middle, rearrange your steps to go from where you started to where you finished.

Here is a small (easier) example of this strategy in action: Say we want to show [itex]cos^2\left(x\right) = 1-sin^2\left(x\right)[/tex]<br /> Working forwards:<br /> [tex]cos^2\left(x\right)=\left(\frac{e^{i x}+e^{-i x}}{2}\right)^2=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}[/tex] <br /> Now hold that thought while we work backwards...<br /> <br /> Working backwards:<br /> [tex]1-sin^2\left(x\right) = 1-\left(\frac{e^{i x}-e^{-i x}}{2 i}\right)^2=1-\frac{e^{2 i x}-2+e^{-2 i x}}{-4}=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}[/tex]<br /> <br /> Then to write the final proof, you would just rearrange the steps:<br /> [tex]cos^2\left(x\right)=\left(\frac{e^{i x}+e^{-i x}}{2}\right)^2=\frac{e^{2 i x} + 2 + e^{-2 i x}}{4}=1-\frac{e^{2 i x}-2+e^{-2 i x}}{-4}=1-\left(\frac{e^{i x}-e^{-i x}}{2 i}\right)^2=1-sin^2\left(x\right)[/tex][/itex]
[itex] <br /> Dear maze, thanks a lot for your efforts and spending your precious time on the problem.<br /> Your method is really impressive and shows your multidimensional thinking.But the problem is that the method you supplied is a lengthy one and can be extremely confusing in long trigo expressions like mine is the case.I would like a simple approach.[/itex]
 

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