How Can Systems Achieve Negative Temperature Without Crossing Absolute Zero?

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    Negative Temperature
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of negative temperature in physical systems, exploring how such states can be achieved without crossing absolute zero. Participants inquire about the mechanisms behind this phenomenon, its implications for thermodynamics, and potential connections to concepts like negative pressure and vacuum energy density.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how negative temperature can be achieved without crossing absolute zero, suggesting the possibility of a phase transition or discontinuity.
  • Another participant raises the idea that systems at negative temperature could allow heat to flow from negative to positive temperatures, potentially leading to more than 100% efficient engines.
  • A participant proposes a connection between negative temperature and negative pressure related to positive vacuum energy density.
  • Several participants emphasize the importance of searching for previous discussions on the topic, indicating that it has been addressed in the forum before.
  • References to external sources, such as Wikipedia, are mentioned as additional resources for understanding the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion does not reach a consensus, as participants express differing views on the implications and mechanisms of negative temperature, and the topic remains unresolved with multiple competing ideas presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully explored the assumptions or definitions related to negative temperature, and the discussion lacks detailed mathematical treatment of the concepts introduced.

tannerbk
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I've read recently about systems with the ability to reach negative temperature: where entropy decreases as energy increases. I have a couple question regarding this. First, how is it possible to reach negative temperature without crossing absolute zero? Is there some discontinuity like a phase transition that allows this to happen? How can negative temperature be related to the kinetic energy of system?

Additionally, wouldn't this allow heat to flow from negative to positive temperature, leading to more than 100% efficient engines?

Finally, could this have anything to do with negative pressure associated with positive vacuum energy density?
 
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Do a forum search. This has been discussed here not too long back.
 
I tried before I posted this, can you provide a link?
 
DO A SEARCH --- use "negative temperature" in quotes
 
phinds said:
DO A SEARCH --- use "negative temperature" in quotes

Use the "Search PF via Google" option at the SEARCH pulldown menu at the top of the page. Then click the thread hit from 3-Jan-2013.

:smile:
 
berkeman said:
Use the "Search PF via Google" option at the SEARCH pulldown menu at the top of the page. Then click the thread hit from 3-Jan-2013.

:smile:

Thanks!
 

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