How Can You Calculate Winning Probabilities in a Game with T's, D's, and I's?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the winning probabilities in a game involving three types of players: T's, D's, and I's. Participants explore methods for determining these probabilities, focusing on theoretical modeling and simulation approaches.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant outlines the game mechanics and player interactions, expressing uncertainty about how to calculate winning probabilities.
  • Another participant suggests two methods: creating a tree diagram to track all possible outcomes or simulating multiple games to estimate the probability of T's winning.
  • A third participant reiterates the two methods and expresses disappointment at the lack of a more sophisticated mathematical approach.
  • A later reply proposes a simplification of the analysis by reducing the player types to T's and non-T's, noting that this could make the tree diagram easier to evaluate.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best method for calculating probabilities, with multiple approaches being discussed and no definitive resolution on which is preferable.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of the game mechanics and the challenges in modeling interactions, particularly regarding the implications of player types and their interactions.

m84uily
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I wanted to model a particular game and determine the probability for each team to win. I have no idea how to do the determination of probability part, but here's the game broken down:

There are 3 types of players, T's, D's and I's.

The amount of each type of player is as follows:
1/8 D
2/8 T
5/8 I
(game is only played in multiples of 8)

All of the T's, D's and I's are placed in a list, every turn 2 distinct players from the list are chosen randomly and interact according to the following:

T--fights I, fights D, peace T
D--kills I, peace D, fights T
I--fights I, dies D, fights T

"fights" - a coin flip determines which player goes back into the list for the next round
"peace" - both players go back into the list for the next round
"kills" - the player who is killing has a 100% chance to remove the other player from the list and return for the next round
"dies" - the player who is dying has a 100% chance to be removed from the list
The game ends when either:
-only T's remain (T win)
-all T's are removed from the list (T lose)

Where should I start in terms of getting the probability breakdown for whether T's win or lose?
 
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There are two methods to do this:

- make a large tree diagram, keeping track of all options (e.g. after one round: [0 D 2 T 5 I or 1 D 1 T 5 I or 1 D 2 T 4 I]). This gives exact values, but takes a while both manually and with computer assistance.
- simulate 10000 (or more) games and just see how often T wins. This does not give an exact result, but if you have some programming knowledge it could be faster.
 
mfb said:
There are two methods to do this:

- make a large tree diagram, keeping track of all options (e.g. after one round: [0 D 2 T 5 I or 1 D 1 T 5 I or 1 D 2 T 4 I]). This gives exact values, but takes a while both manually and with computer assistance.
- simulate 10000 (or more) games and just see how often T wins. This does not give an exact result, but if you have some programming knowledge it could be faster.

I did the second, I'm a bit disappointed there isn't a more clever mathy way to go about things. :frown:
 
There is a possible simplification: as there is just one D, "D peace D" never happens. Every selection of {D,I} leads to a death of one of them. T does not distinguish between the groups, so you can reduce the analysis to two groups: T and non-T.
That should have a reasonable tree diagram and it is much easier to evaluate, as you just have to consider four cases each time (T T, T non-T and T wins, T non-T and non-T wins, non-T non-T). Should be possible with pen and paper.
 

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