How do I find cos and sin values without a calculator?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the cosine and sine values for -1800 degrees using a unit circle approach. Participants explore the geometric representation of these values and the underlying principles without relying on a calculator. The focus is on understanding the concepts from first principles, including the implications of drawing circles and the significance of the unit circle.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about how to start drawing circles to represent -1800 degrees and questions the validity of the cosine and sine values derived from the diagram.
  • Another participant suggests using the unit circle with a radius of 1 and introduces parametric equations to relate the x and y coordinates to cosine and sine values.
  • Some participants agree that at -180 degrees, the x-coordinate corresponds to cos(-180) = -1 and the y-coordinate corresponds to sin(-180) = 0, based on the position of point P on the unit circle.
  • There is a mention of periodicity and the properties of even and odd functions, but the extent of understanding among participants varies.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the values of cos(-1800) = -1 and sin(-1800) = 0 based on the unit circle representation. However, there is uncertainty regarding the method of arriving at these values and the understanding of related concepts like parametric equations and periodicity.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express a desire to keep the discussion simple due to their foundational understanding being unstable. There are references to concepts like periodicity and even/odd functions, but not all participants seem to have a solid grasp of these ideas.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for learners seeking to understand trigonometric functions and their geometric interpretations, particularly those who are new to the concepts of the unit circle and parametric equations.

Casio1
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Please refer to the diagram.

I am asked to find cos - 1800 and sin -1800 by plotting a point p on a circle.

OK I don't understand the following before I begin to answer.

How do I know where to start to draw the circles?

I have the x and y axis. I know that anti-clockwise rotation is positive and clockwise is negative.

If I look first at cos - 1800

I know I am going to draw a semi circle in the clockwise direction, which will represent 1800 but show as - 1800 on the diagram.

I am confused how I draw the sin -1800 and am assuming that I draw the semi circle in a anti-clockwise direction labelled also - 1800 to end up with a circle.

I also don't understand from a drawing how I am supposed to know that cos - 1800 = - 1, and sin - 1800 = 0

From first principles and not looking at the calculator, how would I know that these values are right, I could have drawn the semi-circles from x = 2 or 3 etc?

Please advise if you can.

Kind regards

Casio
 

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For simplicity use the unit circle (radius=1) in your diagrams
I'd use parametric equations in this case to split your axes into $x = \cos(t) \text{ and } y = \sin(t)$.

You've correctly put point P on the graph so what is the value of x at -180? What about y? The values will be equal to $\cos(-180)$ and $\sin(-180)$ respectively.
 
SuperSonic4 said:
For simplicity use the unit circle (radius=1) in your diagrams
I'd use parametric equations in this case to split your axes into $x = \cos(t) \text{ and } y = \sin(t)$.

You've correctly put point P on the graph so what is the value of x at -180? What about y? The values will be equal to $\cos(-180)$ and $\sin(-180)$ respectively.

As I am just learning this from first principles my foundation understanding of the subject is a little unstable at the moment, so I would like to keep things as simple as possible if I we can. Parametric equations might be getting a little too involved just at the moment thanks.

So referring to what you advise above and in conjunction with the diagram, point P is positioned at - x, the point would be using your idea of the radius = 1 being cos - 1800 = - 1

The y-axis or y value when x = - 1 must be that y = 0 with reference to the diagram.

So in conclusion;

cos - 1800 = - 1, and sin - 1800 = 0

Thanks

Casio(Smile)
 
Casio said:
As I am just learning this from first principles my foundation understanding of the subject is a little unstable at the moment, so I would like to keep things as simple as possible if I we can. Parametric equations might be getting a little too involved just at the moment thanks.

So referring to what you advise above and in conjunction with the diagram, point P is positioned at - x, the point would be using your idea of the radius = 1 being cos - 1800 = - 1

The y-axis or y value when x = - 1 must be that y = 0 with reference to the diagram.

So in conclusion;

cos - 1800 = - 1, and sin - 1800 = 0

Thanks

Casio(Smile)

Parametric equations is a fancy way of splitting the x and y axes into components. It enables you to say that whatever the x value is then that is equal to the value of $\cos(t)$ (t is just a variable) and the y value is $\sin(t)$

In this case because P is at (-1,0) then $\cos(-180) = x$ and $\sin(-180) = y$

Without knowing what you've studied so far it's hard to suggest a method of working out. For example you (can) use the unit circle to prove periodicity so you can't say that $\sin(-180) = \sin(-180+360)$. Have you covered even and odd functions (see spoilers for what I mean)
  • An even function is where $f(-x) = f(x)$. Examples are $f(x) = x^2$ and, more thematically appropriate $f(x) = \cos(x)$
  • An odd function is where $f(-x) = -f(x)$. Examples include $f(x) = x^3$ and $f(x) = \sin(x)$

You'd use these functions to say that $\cos(-180)= \cos(180)$ and work out the positive angle
 
SuperSonic4 said:
Parametric equations is a fancy way of splitting the x and y axes into components. It enables you to say that whatever the x value is then that is equal to the value of $\cos(t)$ (t is just a variable) and the y value is $\sin(t)$

In this case because P is at (-1,0) then $\cos(-180) = x$ and $\sin(-180) = y$

Without knowing what you've studied so far it's hard to suggest a method of working out. For example you (can) use the unit circle to prove periodicity so you can't say that $\sin(-180) = \sin(-180+360)$. Have you covered even and odd functions (see spoilers for what I mean)
  • An even function is where $f(-x) = f(x)$. Examples are $f(x) = x^2$ and, more thematically appropriate $f(x) = \cos(x)$
  • An odd function is where $f(-x) = -f(x)$. Examples include $f(x) = x^3$ and $f(x) = \sin(x)$

You'd use these functions to say that $\cos(-180)= \cos(180)$ and work out the positive angle

Hi, yes very briefly but a lot of revision to do on it to get a solid foundation.

Kind regards

Casio
 

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