How Do You Calculate Force from a Two-Dimensional Potential Energy Function?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating force from a two-dimensional potential energy function given by U = 3x³ * y - 7x. Participants are exploring how to derive the force vector from this potential energy function, particularly in the context of multiple variables.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the transition from one-dimensional to two-dimensional force calculations, questioning how to apply the gradient concept in a multi-variable context. There is uncertainty about the correct formulation for the force vector, with suggestions about summing derivatives and clarifications regarding the nature of force as a vector.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the relationship between potential energy and force vectors. Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of partial derivatives to obtain the force vector, but there remains confusion about terminology and the correct approach to the problem.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the implications of working in two dimensions and the definitions of force components, as well as the distinction between integration and differentiation in this context.

Thermon
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Homework Statement


A potential energy function for a two-dimensional force is of the form U = 3x3 * y - 7x.
Find the force that acts at the point (x, y).[/B]

Homework Equations


In a 1-dimensional case:
ΔU = -∫Fx dx
dU = -Fx dx
Fx = -dU/dx

The Attempt at a Solution


I know how to find the force in a 1-dimensional case; it's the gradient at the given x.

But I can't wrap my head around it when there are two variables.

Could it perhaps be the sum of the derivatives; Fx = -(dU/dx + dU/dy)?[/B]
 
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Thermon said:

Homework Statement


A potential energy function for a two-dimensional force is of the form U = 3x3 * y - 7x.
Find the force that acts at the point (x, y).[/B]

Homework Equations


In a 1-dimensional case:
ΔU = -∫Fx dx
dU = -Fx dx
Fx = -dU/dx

The Attempt at a Solution


I know how to find the force in a 1-dimensional case; it's the gradient at the given x.

But I can't wrap my head around it when there are two variables.

Could it perhaps be the sum of the derivatives; Fx = -(dU/dx + dU/dy)?[/B]
The force will be a vector. If ##\phi(x,y)## is a potential for ##\vec F(x,y)## then$$
\vec F(x,y) = \langle \phi_x,\phi_y\rangle$$
 
LCKurtz said:
The force will be a vector. If ##\phi(x,y)## is a potential for ##\vec F(x,y)## then$$
\vec F(x,y) = \langle \phi_x,\phi_y\rangle$$

So it's the combined vector of Vy and Vx? Correct me if I'm wrong, but does that means that the force at (x, y) would be the net vector of the Epot up and downwards against Ekin?
Finding those two would involve finding the integral of both Fx and Fy
 
LCKurtz said:
The force will be a vector. If ##\phi(x,y)## is a potential for ##\vec F(x,y)## then$$
\vec F(x,y) = \langle \phi_x,\phi_y\rangle$$

Thermon said:
So it's the combined vector of Vy and Vx? Correct me if I'm wrong, but does that means that the force at (x, y) would be the net vector of the Epot up and downwards against Ekin?
Finding those two would involve finding the integral of both Fx and Fy

I don't know what you mean by "combined vector" and "net vector" and "upwards and downwards". It is a force vector field having two components or a magnitude and direction. And I don't know what Fx and Fy you are talking about. You get the vector field from the potential by taking the partials of the potential, not integrating, as I gave in the formula above.
 

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