How does an atomic element jump the Quantum fence?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of how electrons of atomic elements transition between quantum and classical domains, often referred to metaphorically as "jumping the quantum fence." Participants explore the nature of this transition, including references to quantum tunneling and activation energy in chemical reactions, while also addressing misconceptions and the use of metaphysical interpretations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question the existence of a "quantum fence" that electrons jump, suggesting that this idea may stem from misunderstandings.
  • One participant references a book by Deepak Chopra, discussing the mystical interpretation of health and materialization, which is critiqued for lacking scientific grounding.
  • Another participant introduces the concept of electron tunneling as a phenomenon where electrons can transition between states without the classical barriers typically expected.
  • There is mention of activation energy in chemical reactions, particularly in biological systems, where quantum tunneling allows reactions to occur without the usual energy input.
  • Concerns are raised about the vagueness of the original question, with suggestions that the boundary between quantum and classical worlds needs clarification.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the concept of a quantum barrier, with some rejecting the notion while others attempt to relate it to established quantum phenomena like tunneling. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the original metaphor of a "quantum fence."

Contextual Notes

Participants note the ambiguity in the original question, highlighting the need for clearer definitions and understanding of quantum mechanics concepts. The discussion also touches on the influence of non-scientific sources on the understanding of physics.

jusme
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I am at loss to understand (from a layman's point of view...with some math-stuff, too) how an element's electron(s) can jump the quantum fence. An element, any element, as shown on the periodic table, has certain characteristics within its 'earthly' domain, the 3-D world we live in. What causes the electron(s) of this element to jump the fence...the area that lies in between the quantum domain and our everyday 3-D domain? Please excuse the way in which I am putting this question across, but for me, right now, it is the best I can muster up for the moment.

Is there a certain 'something' that pushes or pulls an electron(s) across the quantum barrier? Is there possibly a quantum periodic table of the elements?

I had asked this of someone versed in chemistry and was told to look into 'Cooper pairing', being naturals, Linked and twin-Linked pairs. For now I will gladly accept an asnwer to the question I just put up.

I would greatly appreciate a point in a good direction for more information to satisfy my own curiousity.

Thank you for reading this!

Regards,
Justme
 
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There is no quantum fence/barrier that electrons jump to enter some new quantum world. Where did you get this idea ?
 
Some time ago I read a book by Deepak Chopra where he was discussing how the human body could (seemingly) produce what it needs to fullfill a need for a particular state of bodily health...from what appeared to be out of nowhere; neural transmitters/endomorphines, etc. seemd to magically materalize when needed! An endlss supply from what appeared to be a mystical horn-of-plenty. The author used simple graphices to illustrate his point by showing a line where the area above the line was the real physcial world, and that under the line represented the mysterous area from which the material(s) came from. Hence the so-called quantum leap of a material over a fence (the drawn line in his illustration).
 
The only thing with barriers with electrons that I know of is about electron tunnelling.

Signlalling hormones in the body don't just 'pop up', they are part of complex chemical reactions creating them.
 
jusme said:
Some time ago I read a book by Deepak Chopra where he was discussing how the human body could (seemingly) produce what it needs to fullfill a need for a particular state of bodily health...from what appeared to be out of nowhere; neural transmitters/endomorphines, etc. seemd to magically materalize when needed! An endlss supply from what appeared to be a mystical horn-of-plenty. The author used simple graphices to illustrate his point by showing a line where the area above the line was the real physcial world, and that under the line represented the mysterous area from which the material(s) came from. Hence the so-called quantum leap of a material over a fence (the drawn line in his illustration).

I would strongly suggest that you do not use Deepak Chopra as a "source" to explain any physics. Metaphysical mysticism also is not physics, and does not belong in this part of PF.

Zz.
 
jusme said:
I am at loss to understand (from a layman's point of view...with some math-stuff, too) how an element's electron(s) can jump the quantum fence. An element, any element, as shown on the periodic table, has certain characteristics within its 'earthly' domain, the 3-D world we live in. What causes the electron(s) of this element to jump the fence...the area that lies in between the quantum domain and our everyday 3-D domain? Please excuse the way in which I am putting this question across, but for me, right now, it is the best I can muster up for the moment.

Your question here is a rather vague. From what I can gather, you are trying to figure out where is the boundary between quantum and classical world. If it is, then I'm highly confused why you only concentrate on "electrons", since these aren't the only particle, or even system, that are governed by QM description.

But then again, it could be interpreted as you wanting to know how electron tunnels, or how they jump from being in atomic orbitals to free particles, etc... etc. I'm not sure if any meaningful responses can come out of this till there's something clearer.

Zz.
 
Much thanks to ZapperZ and echoSwe for their time (and trouble) trying to give an answer to the original question I posted. It would be best for this thread to end right here...and for me to head on out to Physcis 101.
Thanks for your help.

Jusme
 
Since the OP question seems to relate to biochemistry, maybe this helps

In "normal" chemistry the formation of a molecule requires a specific activation energy.
In biological systems (and other setups - see catalyst) the same reaction occurs without supplying that activation energy.
Generally this is due to forced reactant alignment allowing quantum tunneling to occur.

I suppose you could call this something for nothing.
However
Quantum tunneling is not unique to biological systems, almost anything electronic requires tunneling for it to work.
 
jusme said:
Much thanks to ZapperZ and echoSwe for their time (and trouble) trying to give an answer to the original question I posted. It would be best for this thread to end right here...and for me to head on out to Physcis 101.
Thanks for your help.

Jusme
This is truly heartwarming to read. All the best !
 

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