How Does Mental Illness Impact an Artist's Work?

[zoobyshoe]

It was a serious answer. There's nothing silly or romanticized about it. To many people, writing, painting, or music are the best method for dealing with whatever it is they are dealing with. Why is art about death, losing love, war, etc. etc. so common? — some people listen to music when they are depressed, others make it.

No, I meant since you'd given a serious answer, so would I.

 

[moe darklight]

No, I meant since you'd given a serious answer, so would I.

O, ok, sorry

I wasn't saying depression is wonderful. I went through a pretty deep depression for, well, most of my teenage years (I'm almost 20, so this isn't that long ago). I wouldn't want to go back to that state of mind —I'm one of those annoying "I love life" people now. Only slightly less annoying than those "I hate life" people— but it definitely didn't hurt my creativity. I would spend days without sleep, writing and painting.

A lot of it was a crap-O-licious display of crap; a crap extravaganz-O-rama, if you will: mad, depressing, ramblings. And considering I had just moved to Canada and my English wasn't very good: horrid grammar errors. But some of it was interesting. And I often steal from myself and polish things that I wrote back then. I still write a lot, and better, I think; just not as compulsively as I did back then.

Here's one of my old depressing poems. I was 15 or 16 when I wrote it:

SID THE HALF KID

Sid, the half kid: the kid-mid: won’t stand, won’t sit.
Half stood and underseated, Sid—the mid-kid—half does:
but it won’t do.
Sid: kid mid, half walks, half byes. Half steals, half buys.
And everyone knows “hey! there goes Sid! the half kid!”
Then Sid, Kid-mid, half waves a disconnected “Hi,”
a fragmented smile,
and hellows bit too slow.
And everyone says: “how mice to meat Sid—Sid the half kid.”
Sid half eats, half stares, half speaks, and half cares.
“Half me...” thinks Sid.
And half halved, Sid drinks.
Sid, the half-kid—half suicide, half lives.
Coward!
Poor Sid... the half-kid. Sid always half kids.
Half friends, for Sid—Sid Mid.
Sid is scared S***less.
F***.
Stand up, Sid!

way too much for my taste now, but it still has some amusing lines I'll probably steal for something better.

I think depression is very common among artists, not because the depression itself is what causes the creativity: Hours of deep, brooding introspection are inherent in a depression. This is more likely to be the cause of inspiration than the depressions itself.

 

[zoobyshoe]

O, ok, sorry

I wasn't saying depression is wonderful. I went through a pretty deep depression for, well, most of my teenage years (I'm almost 20, so this isn't that long ago). I wouldn't want to go back to that state of mind —I'm one of those annoying "I love life" people now. Only slightly less annoying than those "I hate life" people— but it definitely didn't hurt my creativity. I would spend days without sleep, writing and painting.

A lot of it was a crap-O-licious display of crap; a crap extravaganz-O-rama, if you will: mad, depressing, ramblings. And considering I had just moved to Canada and my English wasn't very good: horrid grammar errors. But some of it was interesting. And I often steal from myself and polish things that I wrote back then. I still write a lot, and better, I think; just not as compulsively as I did back then.

Here's one of my old depressing poems. I was 15 or 16 when I wrote it:



way too much for my taste now, but it still has some amusing lines I'll probably steal for something better.

I think depression is very common among artists, not because the depression itself is what causes the creativity: Hours of deep, brooding introspection are inherent in a depression. This is more likely to be the cause of inspiration than the depressions itself.

I don't think depression is any more common among artists than among physicists or engineers, (and mathematicians have to be universally acknowledged as all out of their minds). I'm sometimes surprised at the number of threads about depression that get started here by the kinds of students who haunt this forum. Do you find the same thing on sports forums? I dunno. It could be, though, that anyone prone to "deep, brooding, introspection" will find themselves involved in art or science, or some other thing where introspection and general cogitating apply.
-----
Sid, the half-kid sounds like the lyrics to a Who song.

 

[fourier jr]

I just remembered Bill Byrd! He was a catholic composer in protestent england, and the only thing keeping him from being killed were his skills as a composer. he was good enough that queen elizabeth protected him but he was still shunned by the rest of society. that might explain why nothing he wrote is really 'unhinged' happy.

 

[moe darklight]

Do you find the same thing on sports forums? I dunno. It could be, though, that anyone prone to "deep, brooding, introspection" will find themselves involved in art or science, or some other thing where introspection and general cogitating apply.

Yes, probably. Maybe it's more widely known as a trait of the artists simply because artists are more likely to talk about it publicly (either explicitly in an interview, or through their art).

Sid, the half-kid sounds like the lyrics to a Who song.

O no I hate when that happens O well, happens to everyone once in a while; there are only so many words in the english language

what song is it? I don't know any songs by the who.

 

[zoobyshoe]

O no I hate when that happens O well, happens to everyone once in a while; there are only so many words in the english language

what song is it? I don't know any songs by the who.

No, I mean it sounds like something The Who would write. Not actual Who: Pseudo-Who.

 

[DaveC426913]

As an artist with bouts of productivity, I have often argued that a state of angst is often a requirement for creativity. When I'm happy and doing well, my artistic productivity drops to zero.

 

[zoobyshoe]

As an artist with bouts of productivity, I have often argued that a state of angst is often a requirement for creativity. When I'm happy and doing well, my artistic productivity drops to zero.

I guess for you, then, it represents a retreat into the cave to work out problems.

I, personally, have to feel moderately OK about things in general or I can't pick up a pencil to draw.

 

[hypnagogue]

As an artist with bouts of productivity, I have often argued that a state of angst is often a requirement for creativity. When I'm happy and doing well, my artistic productivity drops to zero.

Same for me. I used to be depressed quite a bit and it was this state that impelled me to do art. For me it functioned kind of like hunger or thirst, a negative drive that eventually forces a behavior to satisfy it. The process of creating in this state often felt cathartic, as if I was externalizing the bad vibes and so getting them out of my system. And this all helped both the quality and quantity of my stuff. My dabbling in art, besides fooling around on guitar a bit, has dropped to about nil since I've been generally quite happy and depression free the past few years.

 

[hc_17]

Thanks guys, this is really helping me! anyone else who has something to say, go ahead! :)

 

[zoobyshoe]

Thanks guys, this is really helping me! anyone else who has something to say, go ahead! :)

How are a few random opinions by people who dabble in art on the side of any importance?

 

[rewebster]

Children's art (painting) seems to have a strong correlation, when the child is going through stressful and/or 'abnormal' times, in the painting to be able to 'read' the status of the child sometimes, as to the color, composition, etc. , and is sometimes used to initiate conversations about problems within the child.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Children's art (painting) seems to have a strong correlation, when the child is going through stressful and/or 'abnormal' times, in the painting to be able to 'read' the status of the child sometimes, as to the color, composition, etc. , and is sometimes used to initiate conversations about problems within the child.

Can depression or mentall illness affect the way a child ties their shoe? Yes. Can it affect the way they eat? Yes. Can it affect the way they speak? Yes. Can it affect the way they do homework? Yes. Can it affect the way they interact with others? Yes. Can it affect the way they draw? Yes.

A huge percentage of depressed and mentally ill people have no artistic inclinations.

Michaelangelo was an irritable, cranky person. The Pope, who couldn't paint or sculpt, was vastly more difficult to get along with. Can a Pontiffs depression or mental illness affect his papacy?

Can a computer programmer's depression or mental illness affect his programming?

Can a physicists depression or mental illness affect his experimentation?

 

[moe darklight]

How are a few random opinions by people who dabble in art on the side of any importance?

well, in my case, I dabble in science on the side for fun and do art professionally (well, just starting out professionally) ... I was going to go into biology, but what's the fun in a stable career

I would get a bigger sample though (I assume you're not going by just 3 or 4 people), but I don't think that just because they don't do art professionally it makes them any less of an artist... I can think of more than a few famous artists who had other means of supporting themselves because they couldn't make a cent with their poetry/painting/writing for most of their life (or even all of it in some cases).

 

[rewebster]

didn't mean to hit a nerve there, zoobie---

I thought hc_17 might find reading some about kid's art and relate something that he may be looking for

 

[moe darklight]

Can depression or mentall illness affect the way a child ties their shoe? Yes. Can it affect the way they eat? Yes. Can it affect the way they speak? Yes. Can it affect the way they do homework? Yes. Can it affect the way they interact with others? Yes. Can it affect the way they draw? Yes.

A huge percentage of depressed and mentally ill people have no artistic inclinations.

Michaelangelo was an irritable, cranky person. The Pope, who couldn't paint or sculpt, was vastly more difficult to get along with. Can a Pontiffs depression or mental illness affect his papacy?

Can a computer programmer's depression or mental illness affect his programming?

Can a physicists depression or mental illness affect his experimentation?

I don't think anyone's saying that everyone who suffers from depression automatically becomes a great artist. I wasn't saying that, at least.

My mom is a psychologist who works mostly with traumatized children. Many of her sessions consist of having the child just paint, or play with toys. Sometimes she can get more information out of sitting and watching a kid play or paint, than from asking him questions.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I don't think anyone's saying that everyone who suffers from depression automatically becomes a great artist. I wasn't saying that, at least.

There is a meme to the effect that mentally ill people are also very creative. People still believe the old saying "There is a fine line between genius and madness". It is clear that some people romanticize mental illness as the gateway to genius.

It's a meme that should be killed because, in fact, most mentally ill people lead terrible, painful, unproductive lives.

 

[moe darklight]

There is a meme to the effect that mentally ill people are also very creative. People still believe the old saying "There is a fine line between genius and madness". It is clear that some people romanticize mental illness as the gateway to genius.

It's a meme that should be killed because, in fact, most mentally ill people lead terrible, painful, unproductive lives.

Yea, that's true. I think people get these ideas either because artists tend to approach ideas in ways that most people wouldn't (films by Cronenberg or Aronofsky might lead people to think that they are insane), or because some artists and scientists are simply eccentric or "weird."

There is long way from eccentricity to mental illness, and I agree with you that there is somewhat of a romanticized idea of the "mad scientist" or "tortured artist" — Philip K. Dick was mentally ill; Kafka was just eccentric.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Yea, that's true. I think people get these ideas either because artists tend to approach ideas in ways that most people wouldn't (films by Cronenberg or Aronofsky might lead people to think that they are insane), or because some artists and scientists are simply eccentric or "weird."

There is long way from eccentricity to mental illness, and I agree with you that there is somewhat of a romanticized idea of the "mad scientist" or "tortured artist" — Philip K. Dick was mentally ill; Kafka was just eccentric.

To stand out from the crowd an artist needs 1.) technical skill 2.) creativity.

While certain kinds of mental illness produce concommitant out-of-the-box thought processes that can be substituted for creativity, there is no mental illness that produces technical skill. That has to be developed by constant practice. In most cases mental illness makes that kind of sustained, long term effort impossible. On the other hand you also find obsessive behaviors in mentally ill people. In rare cases they can direct their obsessive tendencies at acquiring technical skills that allow them to articulate their out-of-the-box thinking. People like this are pretty much freaks, and don't represent typical mentally ill people or typical artists.

 

[moe darklight]

To stand out from the crowd an artist needs 1.) technical skill 2.) creativity.

You forgot 3.) a certain je-ne-sais-quoi

 

[zoobyshoe]

You forgot 3.) a certain je-ne-sais-quoi

Oh yeah, You need a magic word or animal sacrifice.

 

[moe darklight]

Oh yeah, You need a magic word or animal sacrifice.

ssshhh! stop giving away our secrets!

 

[rewebster]

You forgot 3.) a certain je-ne-sais-quoi

Besides 1) and 2)

I've heard 3) was:

salesmanship and/or sales management* (self or someone else)


*that is, if you want to be 'known' in your own lifetime


and 4) productivity

 

[hc_17]

How are a few random opinions by people who dabble in art on the side of any importance?

I'm doing a project for my A-level art, we can do whatever we want, as long as it relates back to art, so i chose depression, which is a huge issue as many artists suffered from it, and if people who paint have an opinion on it i would like to hear it so i can incorporate it into my project to understand what different people think of the matter, whether it inspires people to work or not, how it affects them, or how they think it affects other people, the more opinions i get the better

 

[rewebster]

I'm doing a project for my A-level art, we can do whatever we want, as long as it relates back to art, so i chose depression, which is a huge issue as many artists suffered from it, and if people who paint have an opinion on it i would like to hear it so i can incorporate it into my project to understand what different people think of the matter, whether it inspires people to work or not, how it affects them, or how they think it affects other people, the more opinions i get the better

There's different types of depression--are you going to go into that?---

 

[zoobyshoe]

I'm doing a project for my A-level art, we can do whatever we want, as long as it relates back to art, so i chose depression, which is a huge issue as many artists suffered from it, and if people who paint have an opinion on it i would like to hear it so i can incorporate it into my project to understand what different people think of the matter, whether it inspires people to work or not, how it affects them, or how they think it affects other people, the more opinions i get the better

Never mind that.

You like this drawing? :

 

[hc_17]

didn't mean to hit a nerve there, zoobie---

I thought hc_17 might find reading some about kid's art and relate something that he may be looking for

Thankyou i do find it very helpful, i suffer from depression myself and when i was a bit younger i used to write poetry and at my worse i whacked out an awful lot of art and became quite ahead in my class because that's all i ever did to express myself. I think children are just as important, because although my project is based around adults, they go through a lot of the same things adults do which are usually passed off because they are so young.

oh and I am a girl

 

[hc_17]

There's different types of depression--are you going to go into that?---

The main one I am exploring is Bipolar, because during my research I've found it seems to be a lot more common.
And I've already interviewed an artist with bipolar and can't be bothered trying to get in touch with other artists, i was lucky with her, and very grateful for it.

 

[moe darklight]

Never mind that.

You like this drawing? :

Ok, admit it zoobyshoe, you take pictures and press "posterise" on adobe, the jig is up

If your project is strictly about painters, then I'm not of much help; I work in film (starting to, at least). Sometimes I write non-screenplaywise as well (I posted a link to one of my stories about a month ago), but I'm not too serious into it. I'm not much of a painter; the best I can do is doodles like my profile pics.

 

[EnumaElish]

I'm doing a project for my A-level art, we can do whatever we want, as long as it relates back to art, so i chose depression, which is a huge issue as many artists suffered from it, and if people who paint have an opinion on it i would like to hear it so i can incorporate it into my project to understand what different people think of the matter, whether it inspires people to work or not, how it affects them, or how they think it affects other people, the more opinions i get the better

I agree with zooby that depression is more debilitating than enabling. At a very general level (I am not commenting on individual experiences, and I am not a mental health professional), I think fighting with depression (therapy, emotional awareness, etc.) is more likely to contribute to one's focus and productivity. IMO, the people who are more creative are the ones that have a handle on their depression -- they might be conscious of their anger and looking for a way to deal with it. (Or perhaps they are "riding the manic cycle" -- the opposite of depression.) Contrast this with someone who is not even aware that there is anger inside, just depressed; he or she would be more likely to just stare at the TV all day.