How to Determine the Mass of an AGN from Solar Luminosity?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the mass of an Active Galactic Nucleus (AGN) given its luminosity in solar units. Participants explore the complexities involved in this estimation, particularly focusing on the limitations of using mass-luminosity relationships typically applied to main sequence stars.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the applicability of the mass-luminosity relationship for AGNs, noting that it is primarily relevant for main sequence stars.
  • Another participant clarifies the context by confirming the luminosity is given in solar luminosities and specifies that they are discussing a galaxy rather than a star.
  • A participant suggests that luminosity can be used to approximate the mass of a galaxy if distance and total luminosity are known, but emphasizes the complexity of this integration over angular size.
  • It is proposed that knowing the distribution of stars in the galaxy could allow for an integration to estimate mass, assuming a main sequence star distribution, but acknowledges that this approach is complicated if the AGN is currently active.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the methods for estimating mass from luminosity, with no consensus on a definitive approach or resolution of the complexities involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations such as the dependence on the distribution of stars and the complications introduced by an active central engine, which remain unresolved in the discussion.

tomjennings
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How would someone find the mass of an AGN when a solar luminosity is given? I know you can't simply use the mass-luminosity relationship since that only applies to main sequence stars, right?

Thanks.
 
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Do you mean AGB star? And do you mean that its luminosity is given in units of the solar luminosity?
 
Steely Dan said:
Do you mean AGB star? And do you mean that its luminosity is given in units of the solar luminosity?

Sorry. I meant to say galaxy instead of star.

AGN = Active Galactic Nuclei

I am given a luminosity of 12 trillion solar luminosities, and I need to find its mass.
 
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are those the *only* two things?
 
good luck,man!http://www.hergoods.info/avatar1.jpg
 
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Since luminosity is essentially a function of stellar mass, it should be possible to roughly approximate the mass of a galaxy if you know its distance and gross luminosity. This, however, is not a trivial matter. For starters, you would have to integrate its luminosity over its angular size. Nobody really spends much time trying to do this because there are easier ways to get a more accurate estimate.
 
One way to do it is if you know the distribution of stars in the galaxy, assuming they are all main sequence stars (this is basically its initial mass function). Then you could integrate the distribution so that it is normalized to that total luminosity. I recall that if this is done for galaxies like ours, you get a roughly linear relationship between luminosity and mass, and the proportionality constant is of order 1 to 10. But I have never done the calculation. Furthermore, if the central engine is actually currently active, then that seriously complicates matters.
 

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