Human host manipulation

  • Medical
  • Thread starter Evo
  • Start date
  • #26
100
1
If this is true, why isn't the NIH taking notice, applying money time and research to study, educate the public and develop treatment for those infected ?

Rhody... :eek:
could be the numbers themselves? we're "infected" with lots of things that are normally considered pretty benign, or even beneficial. according to Sapolsky, the US military is interested in this, and i can only assume it is not for the sake of curing people of infection.
 
  • #27
bobze
Science Advisor
Gold Member
647
18
Dave,

Here is another book in addition to the one you mentioned from the link: bobze provided:


and more cases of parasites causing their hosts to be more vulnerable to other hosts, amazing...

also


If this is true, why isn't the NIH taking notice, applying money time and research to study, educate the public and develop treatment for those infected ?

Rhody... :eek:

P.S. This stuff is creepy, makes me think that natural selection should expanded to include a sub category: intelligent natural selection, or insidious natural selection, or "I'll be back" natural selection.

Because I think at this point, the evidence isn't there to show necessarily that it has that large of impact on human behavior. However, that isn't to say it doesn't, just that we haven't really looked hard enough.

To be honest though, there are "hints" from research that toxo may certainly be affecting the behavior of people, but I agree with Sapolsky and I think part of the problem is people are scared to research this.

I mean, holy **** think of the implications if we find this little guy making people twice as likely to die in car wrecks or some other violent early death....Or if it really could "cause" schizophrenia. What's that say about "free will"--Scary in deed.
 
  • #28
rhody
Gold Member
630
3
To be honest though, there are "hints" from research that toxo may certainly be affecting the behavior of people, but I agree with Sapolsky and I think part of the problem is people are scared to research this.

I mean, holy **** think of the implications if we find this little guy making people twice as likely to die in car wrecks or some other violent early death....Or if it really could "cause" schizophrenia. What's that say about "free will"--Scary in deed.
bobze, Proton,

You (bobze) hit the NAIL on the head, I am still creeped out about it. However, the pragmatic realistic side of me says we must investigate, to either prove it true, of false with mitigating circumstances. I reported awhile ago that the NIH spends about 1/3 of it's budget on the study of the brain, why not start there with adjunct research and then see where it leads ?

Rhody...
 
  • #29
106
1
I mean, holy **** think of the implications if we find this little guy making people twice as likely to die in car wrecks or some other violent early death....Or if it really could "cause" schizophrenia. What's that say about "free will"--Scary in deed.
Many neurobiologists believe that "free will" is limited. Although man itself is least genetically determined creature we know, genetic / epigenetic causes may alter (steer) behaviors towards certain directions. And at the bottom of this it's not parasites, it's our biology who limits the "free will". Expression of certain genes (or lack thereof) and expression regulation can alter the way we behave in certain areas. Perhaps the most interesting ones being sex / aggressive / cooperation behaviors.

Besides, certain phenotypes will also change the social perception of others. Something as simple as your height and looks can mean some difference in the way other ppl rapport to you.

Sapolsky himself has a very interesting take on "free will", and IIRC he touches on this on his short Toxo talk.
 
Last edited:
  • #30
lisab
Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
1,887
616
If this is true, why isn't the NIH taking notice, applying money time and research to study, educate the public and develop treatment for those infected ?
Maybe all the decision makers at NIH are toxo-positive...
 
  • #31
bobze
Science Advisor
Gold Member
647
18
Many neurobiologists believe that "free will" is limited. Although man itself is least genetically determined creature we know, genetic / epigenetic causes may alter (steer) behaviors towards certain directions. And at the bottom of this it's not parasites, it's our biology who limits the "free will". Expression of certain genes (or lack thereof) and expression regulation can alter the way we behave in certain areas. Perhaps the most interesting ones being sex / aggressive / cooperation behaviors.

Besides, certain phenotypes will also change the social perception of others. Something as simple as your height and looks can mean some difference in the way other ppl rapport to you.

Sapolsky himself has a very interesting take on "free will", and IIRC he touches on this on his short Toxo talk.
I agree with them, between genetics and acquired responses to environment free will is very limited--I suppose it was more tongue and cheek :tongue2:


bobze, Proton,

You (bobze) hit the NAIL on the head, I am still creeped out about it. However, the pragmatic realistic side of me says we must investigate, to either prove it true, of false with mitigating circumstances. I reported awhile ago that the NIH spends about 1/3 of it's budget on the study of the brain, why not start there with adjunct research and then see where it leads ?

Rhody...
I totally agree Rhody, my morbid curiosity would rather know if my behavior is being affect by a parasite. I suppose though, there are a great many people that don't think like you and I. Maybe they are all the infected ones :), smells like a zombie apocalypse to me! Lol
Maybe all the decision makers at NIH are toxo-positive...
Almost like some kind of sci-fi alien take over thriller conspiracy movie :biggrin: We might have to take matters to the extreme and invent the toxo inquisition.
 
  • #32
rhody
Gold Member
630
3
Maybe all the decision makers at NIH are toxo-positive...
Lisab,

One can only hope... :smile:

Rhody...
 
  • #33
rhody
Gold Member
630
3
Okay, I was browsing news and, gulp... I read this... really, I am not making this up read for http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/12/09/worms.health/?hpt=T2"...
This month, the man's experience treating himself with parasitic worms was published in a medical journal. Depending on who's telling the story, his journey is one of a brilliant, empowered patient who found an amazingly effective treatment for himself and possibly others who suffer the same debilitating disease -- or the dangerous tale of an irresponsible medical rebel who could have killed himself and, by telling his story, might be inspiring others to do the same thing. As with any experimental treatment, you should not try this at home.
and
After he arrived, the doctor in Thailand extracted roundworm eggs from the stool of an 11-year-old infected girl. She gave the trichuris trichiura eggs to the patient, but he now faced another hurdle. The eggs needed to be cleaned in case the girl had hepatitis or some other infectious disease, and the eggs needed to mature for them to be helpful. It was up to him to clean the eggs and grow them in a process called "embryonation." "There wasn't much guidance on how to do it, since most people are trying to destroy these worms, not grow them," he says. But he managed to do it and ingested first a dose of 500 eggs and then another of 1,000. The worms could live in his intestinal track for many years.
and
By 2007, having made so much progress, the patient wanted to document his journey scientifically, and he contacted various researchers to help him, including P'ng Loke, who was then a postdoctoral fellow in immunology at the University of California-San Francisco. "He e-mailed me, and I ignored it," Loke remembers. "I was very skeptical at first, but he convinced me to have lunch with him." At their meeting, the patient laid out his story in more detail, and Loke became fascinated. "It's an amazing story, and he's quite possibly one of the smartest people I know," he says.
The lingering question I have is, once his symptoms are under control for good, hopefully, how does he rid himself of the worms. The article did not mention this. I assume by natural elimination ?

Rhody...

P.S. Evo... See what you started, first we have unwitting asymptomatic hosts (humans) with enlarged lymph glands, then we have behavior changes linked to other parasites, now this. People treating serious ulcerative colitis with these things, and living to tell the story. And the medical establishment balking at his approach. A fine mess, I must say.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Related Threads on Human host manipulation

  • Last Post
Replies
4
Views
2K
Replies
11
Views
1K
  • Last Post
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • Last Post
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • Last Post
Replies
4
Views
710
  • Last Post
Replies
15
Views
1K
Replies
2
Views
381
Replies
1
Views
5K
Top