Hydrogen bound by only grav force (Bohr theory etc)

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on deriving expressions for the Bohr model of hydrogen when only gravitational forces bind protons and electrons, excluding electric charge. Key equations referenced include E_n = mc^2 * alpha * 1 / (2n^2) and a_0 = hbar^2/(mc*alpha). The participant suggests that without electric charge, the Bohr radius (a_0) would approach zero, and the energy levels (E_n) would be fundamentally altered, potentially simplifying to E_n = -Gm1m2/r. The challenge lies in expressing these variables in terms of quantum levels (n).

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of gravitational forces and potential energy (E = -Gm1m2/r)
  • Familiarity with the Bohr model of the atom
  • Knowledge of quantum mechanics, specifically angular momentum quantization (L = n h / 2π)
  • Basic grasp of fundamental constants such as Planck's constant (h) and gravitational constant (G)
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the implications of gravitational binding in atomic models
  • Explore modifications to the Bohr model without electric charge
  • Study the derivation of energy levels in gravitationally bound systems
  • Investigate the relationship between quantum numbers (n) and gravitational forces in atomic structures
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for physicists, students studying quantum mechanics, and anyone interested in alternative atomic models that consider gravitational interactions over electromagnetic forces.

kpou
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Homework Statement


If electric charge did not exist, and protons and electrons were only bound together by gravitational forces to form hydrogen, derive the expressions for a_0 and E_n and compute the energy and frequency of the H_alpha line and limit of Balmer series.


Homework Equations


E_n=mc^2 * alpha * 1 / (2n^2)
E_n=-mk^2Z^2e^4/(2hbar*n^2)=-E_0Z^2/n^2
a_0=hbar^2/(mc*alpha)=hbar^2/mke^2
1/lambda=Z^2R(1/nf^2-1/ni^2)


The Attempt at a Solution


If electric charge did not exist, then the balance of electron orbit and distance would change. Bohr's radius would just be zero i would imagine since it depends on electron charge. E_n would suffer the same fate... Would E_n just become mc^2? The radius would have to still be a number as the two do still have mass and gravity would affect them.

Edit:
F=Gm1m2/r^2 is the force on either exerted by the other and
E=-Gm1m2/r is the gravitational potential energy

The energy of the electron E_n must be strictly dependent on this.

How do I "derive" an expression from E_n or a_0 when their original formulas must be completely nixed?

Is there supposed to be a way of expressing it with n levels?

Otherwise I propose the energy of the electron is -Gm1m2/r as there is no kinetic energy.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
One of the key components of the Bohr model is the electron's angular momentum must be an integer multiple of Planck's constant divided by 2 pi:

L = n h / 2 π . . . with n = 1, 2, 3, ...​
 

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