Is it Defined, Or Can It Be Proven?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion centers around the equivalence of the expressions a - b and a + (-b) within the context of mathematical definitions and proofs. Participants explore whether this equality can be proven or if it is merely a matter of definition.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants examine the definitions of subtraction and the additive inverse, questioning how these concepts relate to the equality in question. Some explore the implications of different definitions of subtraction and their impact on the proof.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing various perspectives on the definitions involved. Some have offered reasoning and examples to support their views, while others express uncertainty about the implications of these definitions. There is no explicit consensus on the matter yet.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the potential for multiple interpretations of subtraction based on different definitions, highlighting the need for clarity regarding the uniqueness of the additive inverse in the context of abstract algebra.

Bashyboy
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Can the equality a-b = a + (-b) be proven, or are a - b and a + (-b) defined to be the same?
 
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bashyboy said:
Can the equality a-b = a + (-b) be proven, or are a - b and a + (-b) defined to be the same?

It can be proven. I will use ##^-b## for the additive inverse of ##b## so not to confuse it with subtraction. So you want to know whether ##a +^-b = a-b##. Remembering that ##a-b## is the number you can add to ##b## to get ##a##, let's check whether it works:$$
b +(a + ^-b) = b +(^-b +a) = (b + ^-b) + a = 0 + a = a$$ so it works. Can you fill in the reason for each step?
 
I understand each of the properties you appealed to, to justify each step; but I do not see how this shows that
a - b and a + (-b) are equivalent.
 
Bashyboy said:
I understand each of the properties you appealed to, to justify each step; but I do not see how this shows that
a - b and a + (-b) are equivalent.

I just showed that if you add ##a+^-b## to ##b## you get ##a##. That is the definition of ##a-b## since ##a-b## is the number you can add to ##b## to get ##a##. So ##a+^-b## is ##a-b##.
 
I would take it as the definition of subtraction. If you want to prove it, you have to specify what other definition of subtraction that you're using. LCKurtz is defining a-b (for arbitrary a and b) as the unique number x such that b+x=a. If you add -b to both sides of this equality, you see that x=a+(-b). I wouldn't say that this is the definition of subtraction. It's just a definition of subtraction.
 
Funny: The wikipedia article on subtraction uses LCKurtz's definition, but the wikipedia article on the integers uses Fredrik's definition.

With LCKurtz's definition, that subtraction is the inverse function of addition is axiomatic, but that subtraction is equivalent to adding with the additive inverse is a theorem. With Fredrik's definition, it's the other way around.
 
Bashyboy said:
Can the equality a-b = a + (-b) be proven, or are a - b and a + (-b) defined to be the same?

A little bit of both. The issue concerns whether (-b) is a unique element.

In abstract algebra the ring axiom says that for every ##a## there is some ##x## such that ##a + x = 0_R##. It does not claim how many ##x## exist for a given ##a##. So, this is what you have to prove.

If ##-b## isn't unique you might end up getting multiple answers when doing a subtraction!
 

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