Is Poincare symmetry the real thing?

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the validity of Poincare symmetry in theoretical physics, particularly its role in constructing models without infinities. Participants argue that while approximate theories serve as construction tools, true Poincare symmetry is essential for deriving conservation laws via Noether's theorem, which underpins fundamental physics. The conversation highlights the limitations of lattice models in maintaining full Poincare symmetry and the implications for the Standard Model (SM) of particle physics, emphasizing that dropping such symmetries undermines the theoretical framework necessary for guiding theory development.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Poincare symmetry and its implications in physics
  • Familiarity with Noether's theorem and conservation laws
  • Knowledge of lattice models in quantum field theory
  • Basic concepts of the Standard Model of particle physics
NEXT STEPS
  • Explore the implications of Noether's theorem in various physical theories
  • Investigate the limitations of lattice models in quantum field theory
  • Study the role of symmetries in the formulation of the Standard Model
  • Learn about dimensional regularization and its applications in particle physics
USEFUL FOR

The discussion is beneficial for theoretical physicists, quantum field theorists, and researchers interested in the foundational aspects of symmetries in physics, particularly those working on the Standard Model and beyond.

  • #31
A. Neumaier said:
There are many actions invariant under the group of the lattice but not under the rotation group. All these must be excluded by fine-tuning. There is no renormalization criterion that would exclude the rotation symmetry-violating higher order terms of the action.
Why do you think so? The straightforward continuous limit is nothing else but what renormalization gives. Of course, with postulating some symmetries one can restrict the terms which are allowed in a renormalization procedure. But this does not give the other terms greater long distance effects. They may disappear in the long distance limit as well. What survives at long distances are only the lowest order terms.
 
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  • #32
Demystifier said:
But isn't a similar feature present in standard field theories? Even though the equations of motion are dynamical, one puts restrictions on initial conditions, e.g. that the field must vanish at infinity. What's the difference between such standard restrictions and your restrictions?
Why do you ask me?

I think that your claim that there is a certain distinction between fixed and dynamical degrees of freedom has a problem with the preferred coordinates - the straightforward example of something fixed, as describing absolute space and time - fulfilling a quite dynamical-looking equation.

It was an aspect of my claim that covariance is nothing physical, given that every classical theory allows a covariant formulation.

If one, anyway, has to add some fixed boundary conditions even for really dynamical entities, your problem to distinguish them becomes even greater.
 

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