Is the clustering found in the universe a matter of perspective?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the relationship between the clustering of galaxies in the universe and the perspective from which they are observed. Participants explore whether different distribution models, such as the von Mises distribution, could influence our understanding of cosmic structures and the laws of nature. The scope includes theoretical considerations, observational implications, and the nature of cosmic topology.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the distribution of galaxy clusters could be influenced by the perspective from which they are mapped, proposing the use of distribution models like the von Mises distribution.
  • Another participant describes the universe as topologically "flat" and discusses the evaluation of clusters in a four-dimensional model, indicating that clustering can be computed in a way that minimizes observer dependence.
  • A different viewpoint asserts that the distribution of matter in the universe remains constant regardless of the observer's position, emphasizing that the laws of nature do not change with perspective.
  • One participant notes that the observed flat topology of space-time is derived from astronomical observations and models, specifically referencing measurements from the Planck satellite and Baryon Acoustic Oscillations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the perspective of observation affects the understanding of cosmic clustering and the laws of nature. Some argue for the influence of perspective, while others maintain that the distribution of matter and the laws of nature are invariant to the observer's position.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of cosmic topology and the challenges in modeling the universe's structure. There are unresolved questions regarding the appropriateness of different distribution models and the implications of observer-dependent versus observer-independent approaches.

socean
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While reading about von Mises distributions I wondered if the distribution of clusters such as galaxies could be related to the way they are being "mapped".

Suppose we observing our universe from a particular perspective, perhaps described by something like a von Mises distribution, or other distribution model :

http://openi.nlm.nih.gov/detailedresult.php?img=2848649_1471-2105-11-126-3&req=4

Is there a theoretical distribution model to our universe? While the "shape" of pre-spacetime force/stuff is probably not a torus, its something, is it not? Is it possible to determine what it might be?

If we could change our distribution/perspective, everything would look entirely different would it not?

What might we learn if we used different distribution models for our cosmological data?

Would we still observe the same general laws of nature from the perspective of different distributions?

What might the stuff/force be that could have "shape"?
 
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So far, the universe appears to be topologically "flat", spherically symmetric, and mildly imhomogeneous with slight scale dependence. Clusters are evaluated in a four dimensional model based upon two spherically angular coordinates and red shift, in which the time/distance dimension is almost degenerate since the time span of astronomy is so short relative to the lifetime of the universe. So it is possible to compute clustering in a way that is not very dependent on the location of an observer simply by using tools such as 3D Euclidian distance.

A von Mises distribution is circular rather than spherical and the analog of a normal distribution which probably doesn't capture the observed distribution.
 
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The distribution of stuff in the observable universe is what it is. It wouldn't change positions just because it is being looked at from a different place (I'm omitting the time-lag of light for distance objects)

Likewise, the laws of nature don't change just because you change positions.
 
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BTW, the observed "flat" topology of space-time comes from astronomy observations fitted to models of space-time. For example, the most precise measure of the flatness of the topology of space-time comes from the Planck satellite's cosmic background radiation measurements supplemented by other similar large section of the sky astronomy measurements of things like Baryon Acoustic Oscillations (basically a measure of ansitropy in visible matter).
 

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