Is the Leech Lattice a Lie Group?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether the Leech lattice can be classified as a Lie group. Participants explore the definitions and characteristics of Lie groups and lattices, and how these concepts relate to each other, particularly in the context of the E8 lattice.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions if the Leech lattice qualifies as a Lie group, indicating a lack of understanding of the concept.
  • Another participant defines a Lie group as a continuous group, suggesting that since a lattice is a discrete subgroup, it cannot possess a Lie group structure.
  • A participant shares their confusion regarding the classification of E8, noting conflicting information about whether it is a Lie group or a Lie algebra, and expresses a desire to understand the relationship between E8 and the Leech lattice.
  • The same participant outlines a process for understanding Lie groups and algebras, mentioning the concept of roots and how they can generate a lattice through integer linear combinations, while asserting that this lattice is not related to the original Lie group.
  • Another participant expresses appreciation for the overview provided and shares their intention to study groups and Lie groups more thoroughly.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the Leech lattice is a Lie group. There are multiple competing views regarding the definitions and relationships between lattices, Lie groups, and Lie algebras.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the definitions and relationships between the concepts discussed, particularly regarding the classification of E8 and its connection to the Leech lattice. There is an acknowledgment of the need for further study to clarify these topics.

Aztral
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Leech lattice is a 'lie group?"

My understanding of Lie groups is non-existent.

But I'm trying to understand if the Leech lattice is a 'lie group?"
 
Physics news on Phys.org


A Lie group is essentially a continuous group, which means that its elements are described by a number of smoothly varying parameters.

As I understand it, a lattice is a discrete subgroup of Rn under addition, so it is not continuous and thus has no Lie group structure.
 


Hi,

Ya..I'm getting most of my info off wikipedia (garbage-in garbage-out).

I was trying to extrapolate from E8 (which I thought was a Lie group) to to the Leech lattice. On wikipedia the entry for E8 says..."E8 is any of several closely related exceptional simple Lie groups, linear algebraic groups or Lie algebras of dimension 248."

I've now found other references saying E8 is a Lie Algebra...grrr. (as well of a list of the Lie Groups).

Anywayz, I've downloaded a book on Abstract Algebra and I'm hoping that sheds some light on Lattices, Lie Groups, etc. :)
 


Aztral said:
Hi,

Ya..I'm getting most of my info off wikipedia (garbage-in garbage-out).

I was trying to extrapolate from E8 (which I thought was a Lie group) to to the Leech lattice. On wikipedia the entry for E8 says..."E8 is any of several closely related exceptional simple Lie groups, linear algebraic groups or Lie algebras of dimension 248."

I've now found other references saying E8 is a Lie Algebra...grrr. (as well of a list of the Lie Groups).

Anywayz, I've downloaded a book on Abstract Algebra and I'm hoping that sheds some light on Lattices, Lie Groups, etc. :)

OK, I now see what's going on here, but it takes quite a bit to develop it. In outline, it goes like this:

You start with a Lie group, which is a group described by n continuous parameters.
You can investigate the Lie group by looking at its local structure, near the identity element. This gives rise to an n-dimensional vector space with a 'Lie bracket', which quantifies how elements of the group fail to commute. This is a Lie algebra.
To classify Lie algebras (specifically 'simple' Lie algebras), you can use a method of 'roots', where roots are a finite number of vectors in r-dimensional euclidean space with certain properties.
Finally, we can take all possible integer linear combinations of these root vectors to get a lattice. This is a group under addition, but as far as I can tell it is not related to the original Lie Group we started with.

Hope that sheds a little light. I'd recommend either:
i) Getting a good book on Lie algebras and working through this fully.
ii) Take a definition of the lattice your interested which doesn't need all this stuff and don't worry about it.
 


Thanks for the overview henry_m! I've always found a bit of a synopsis about what I'm about to study keeps me more focused :)

I'm kind of starting a bit before i). I'm trying to get up to speed on "groups" in general before proceeding on to Lie Groups. I've download a few pdf books.

Anyway, thanks again!
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
816
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
4K