Is the story of Noah's flood fact or fiction?

[gabby989062]

im done with my non christian part, know i need a few more references for christain. I could use a book online, or a site, which i am haveing trouble finding. so if anyone has a suggestion please reply.

 

[honestrosewater]

im done with my non christian part, know i need a few more references for christain. I could use a book online, or a site, which i am haveing trouble finding. so if anyone has a suggestion please reply.

http://www.sixdaycreation.com/facts/flood/index.html
http://www.answersincreation.org/flood.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/ev_noah.htm
http://www.christiananswers.net/creation/menu-catastrophe.html
I didn't read all of those- just perused them; I think they're pretty safe bets though. If you want more, you should try goolging combinations of "noah's flood" or "flood" and "creation" or "creationist" or "creationism" etc.

 

[Janitor]

I have not read honestrosewater's links. I wonder if any of them explain how Noah was able to find Australia in his ark before the flooding started, in order to gather up samples of marsupials and other creatures indigenous to that continent.

I can't remember if the Bible has Noah collecting samples of terrestrial plants. Wouldn't weeks in deep seawater put at least some plant species at risk of extinction?

 

[misskitty]

It probably would put some of the species at risk of dying off.

 

[honestrosewater]

I have not read honestrosewater's links. I wonder if any of them explain how Noah was able to find Australia in his ark before the flooding started, in order to gather up samples of marsupials and other creatures indigenous to that continent.

I can't remember if the Bible has Noah collecting samples of terrestrial plants. Wouldn't weeks in deep seawater put at least some plant species at risk of extinction?

What, you guys can't read? The last link is an FAQ- I found the answers in a minute. The link says the Bible says the animals came to Noah- Noah didn't have to go round them up. And it says something about the seeds being able to survive- the adult plants didn't have to.
The believers really have an advantage (or an out, depending on how you look at it)- if an omnipotent being wants something done, what's to stop it? There isn't much point in saying such and such couldn't have happened when there's such a being involved. I think you really have to start from the same assumptions in order to resolve the question of whether the flood was possible.

 

[Janitor]

... if an omnipotent being wants something done, what's to stop it? ...

True, He could have floated a pair of kangaroos across the ocean to Palestine. Or He could have airmailed them. But those who believe in a truly omnipotent deity have to wonder how He could have goofed up badly enough with His creation (which He originally labeled "good") that He felt it necessary to kill 99.99999999 percent of it by flooding.

 

[honestrosewater]

True, He could have floated a pair of kangaroos across the ocean to Palestine. Or He could have airmailed them. But those who believe in a truly omnipotent deity have to wonder how He could have goofed up badly enough with His creation (which He originally labeled "good") that He felt it necessary to kill 99.99999999 percent of it by flooding.

Well, don't shoot the messenger, but some say it's because people were given free will. That is, people are to blame for all the bad in the world. I know, what about natural disasters and such- well, some say that bad things are justified by allowing for even better good things. For example, if there were no poverty, there couldn't be charity- so poverty (bad) is justified by making charity (good) possible.

 

[TsunamiJoe]

hm also just for additional information, it was 7 of both male and female of every species

also i was watching a program once, and it had mentioned something about the plates having slid together which caused a dramatic burst in the cracks that leaked a lot of the underground water, which could account for long periods of rain. also keep in mind that even today in some deserts it won't rain for years, but every now and then it will rain for weeks on end

 

[misskitty]

What program was that? Sounds really interesting. This has become quite the long running thread.

I wonder...If that ark had to fit that many animals and it was the size of a modern day cruise ship made out of wood...Where did Noah get all the wood? He lived in the desert didn't he? Trees don't really grow in the deserts of the Middle East.

 

[dextercioby]

What's this thread still doing in the HM section ? : I think it's worthy of Ivan's forum...

Daniel.

 

[Grogs]

hm also just for additional information, it was 7 of both male and female of every species

Not entirely true. It initially states 2 of every animal. A few verses later, it states '7 of every clean animal, 2 of every unclean animal, and 7 of every bird.' The extra clean animals and birds were apparently used (in part) as sacrifices after the flood was over.

BTW, I personally tend to favor the localized flooding of the Black Sea region theory. I could very easily see how a person who lived through that may very well have thought the entire world was flooded.

 

[misskitty]

I still want to know where all that wood came from.

 

[TsunamiJoe]

well you also need to think of the fact that the middle east was more likely an oasis back then, after all many think that's where a high majority of dinosaurs had lived - so it wasnt the desertous place we know today

and grog, considering that was found from a past pastor of mine from when I was lutheran, I'm going to believe someone whos had proper schooling on the matter.

 

[airkapp]

hmm Genesis 1-11 should be taken as mythology. They can be compared to various Babylonian myths (or otherwise pagan myths). I'm a Christian and I see this as metaphorical affirmation of Jehovah and how he related to a certain group of people in a certain time period. For a more scientific explanation, see the ice age floods. A great disasterous flood that could account for the mythologies presented. This doens't mean we could necessarily discount the reading. It presents anthropological account of who these ancient cultures were and how they related to there society. Keep account various idioms, cultural expressions, connotations, is very important in reading any ancient text. Noah's flood, if taken literally presents a wide variety of scientific and logical problems. Basic ones such as, how could all the different species (even two of every kind) be placed in one boat. It would take a boat the size of South America for such. Secondly, assuming the animals were taken on the boat and kept alive, it would be nonsenical and incredulous to believe that all the animals could be kept from ripping each other apart. The fesces and waste product would of created unlivable sanitary conditions that would of easily killed them off in less then 40 days. Problems as such can stem back to Adam stories if taken literally. There is no logical explanation as to how a dinosaur and primitive man can survive at one time. Dating methods (radioactive decay) etc, effectively disprove any flood that could of occurred 10,000 or so years ago. Creationists often attack the methods but if you search out www.talkorigins.com you will effectively see that every creationist myth propogated has been utterly refuted with nothing left to stand on. There may be no such thing as proof in regards to Science, but this is about as close to convincing evidence as you'll get.

good luck on your paper

 

[TsunamiJoe]

i didnt claim they did live at the same time, just the same region, and personaly i find the radiocative dating to have many possible flaws, such as if an object were to come across any sort of radiation it can alter the readouts by thousands upon thousands of years

but aside from that, I do in general agree with your statement, that a lot of the occurances in the bible, are not persay reality, but a way of telling a story to teach some sort of moral