Is There a Limit to Human Force Generation?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the question of whether there is a limit to the amount of force a human can generate, particularly in the context of extraordinary feats such as leaping great distances, as depicted in superhero narratives. Participants explore the biological and physical implications of human force generation, comparing it to animal capabilities and theoretical scenarios involving fictional characters like Superman.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the feasibility of a human leaping 660 feet, referencing calculations based on physics equations.
  • Another participant suggests that the discussion may be more biological than physical, noting that some animals can generate more force than humans due to anatomical differences.
  • Several participants discuss Superman's abilities, with one arguing that he could exert infinite force to achieve speeds beyond light, while another emphasizes that Superman originally leaped rather than flew.
  • A participant expresses difficulty in debunking the claim of a 660-foot leap and seeks to understand the weight required for such a jump, comparing it to the Hulk's musculature.
  • Some participants propose methods for estimating the upper limit of energy used in a jump, including calculations based on ATP molecules in muscles and the energy they release.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the limits of human force generation, with some focusing on biological aspects while others delve into theoretical physics. There is no consensus on the feasibility of extraordinary feats like leaping 660 feet or the implications of Superman's abilities.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the assumptions made in calculations, the dependence on biological factors that may not be fully understood, and the speculative nature of comparing fictional characters to real human capabilities.

wscg
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is there a limit to the amount of force a human can generate?

for example in superhero physics it is shown the original superman can leap 660 feet. The author has shown the amount of force required to accomplish this

f=ma, a=v/t, v^2=2gh

Velocity>v^2=2*32*660> 205/sec or 140miles per/hour

Acceleration>a=200f/sec/1/4sec > 800f/sec^2 or 250m/sec^2

F= 100kg*250m/sec^2> 25000 kgm/sec^2 or 5600 pounds

I know that a human couldn't possibly leap 660 feet so how do I debunk this? Is there a limit to the amount of force a human can generate? And would it be wise to compare this to high jump records?
 
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This is more a biology question than physics. There are a lot of animals that can generate more force than a human can, and the differences are only anatomical, they use the same "food to energy" mechanisms, they have similar structures made from the same materials (bones, muscles) but arranged differently or in bigger sizes.
 
wow, i don't have any idea you can calculate with known ways
 
Superman could exert more force than that. Consider that he flew around the Earth faster than the speed of light to go back in time.

In order for him to accelerate arbitrarily close to the speed of light, he would have to have arbitrarily high kinetic energy. More loosely speaking, he would need infinite energy to go at the speed of light and he reached that speed in a finite amount of time, so he must be able to exert INFINITE force.

Then he proceeded to go faster than the speed of light, but at this point, physics has left the building.
 
Pagan Harpoon said:
Superman could exert more force than that. Consider that he flew around the Earth faster than the speed of light to go back in time.

In order for him to accelerate arbitrarily close to the speed of light, he would have to have arbitrarily high kinetic energy. More loosely speaking, he would need infinite energy to go at the speed of light and he reached that speed in a finite amount of time, so he must be able to exert INFINITE force.

Then he proceeded to go faster than the speed of light, but at this point, physics has left the building.

yeah but the original superman didn't fly he leaped. Specifically he leaped 1/8th of a mile. That's what I'm working with as flying would just be a bit complicated.Besides, him flying is not really plausible either as there is no energy source, or reaction when he flies.

I just can't figure out how to debunk this, as it is not possible for a human to leap 660 feet in a single bound. I did the math for the highest high jump, which is significantly less force.

Is there a way to show how much weight a person would require to jump 660 feet? What I mean here is that the hulk's musculature is bigger than superman therefore it is reasonably plausible that he would leap more than superman.
 
You could estimate an upper limit to the energy used in a jump by :

1. estimating the number of available ATP molecules in legs (2x a quadriceps muscle for example).

2. Finding out how much energy each ATP molecule releases when it's used up.

Then calculate how high this can bring a human with h=E/mg.

It's a very rough first approximation. You could then refine be finding out how much ATP is typically used in a jump, if there are other molecules that are sources of jump energy, other muscles, consider loss etc etc.

Here's for how muscles work:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_contraction
 
Dr Lots-o'watts said:
You could estimate an upper limit to the energy used in a jump by :

1. estimating the number of available ATP molecules in legs (2x a quadriceps muscle for example).

2. Finding out how much energy each ATP molecule releases when it's used up.

Then calculate how high this can bring a human with h=E/mg.

It's a very rough first approximation. You could then refine be finding out how much ATP is typically used in a jump, if there are other molecules that are sources of jump energy, other muscles, consider loss etc etc.


Here's for how muscles work:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_contraction

thanks
 

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