Is There a Limit to Solving Difficult Polynomial Problems?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding a specific value of "a" in the limit expression involving polynomials, specifically the limit of a rational function as x approaches -2. Participants explore the conditions under which the limit exists and the necessary factorization of the numerator.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant poses a limit problem involving the expression (3x^2 + ax + a + 3) / (x^2 + x - 2) and seeks guidance on solving it.
  • Another participant suggests that for the limit to exist, the numerator must equal zero when x approaches -2, leading to the equation 3x^2 + ax + a + 3 = 0.
  • Several participants discuss the need for the numerator to factor in a specific way to eliminate the (x + 2) term in the denominator.
  • Hints are provided regarding the structure of the numerator, suggesting it should take the form (3x + k) to match the leading coefficient.
  • There is a discussion about the choice of factors, with one participant questioning the use of (mx + k) versus (x + 2)(x + k) for the factorization.
  • Participants explore the implications of different values of "a" and how they affect the factorization and limit.
  • Some participants express confusion about the reasoning behind choosing specific forms for the factors and seek clarification on the principles guiding these choices.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying degrees of understanding regarding the hints and factorization methods. There is no consensus on the best approach to factor the numerator or the reasoning behind choosing certain forms for the factors.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the polynomial's degree influences the choice of factorization, and there are unresolved questions about the principles guiding these choices. The discussion reflects a range of assumptions and interpretations regarding the problem.

Dethrone
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Is there a number "a" such that

limit of ((3x^2 + ax + a + 3) / (x^2 + x -2)) as x approaches -2.

I have attached a picture of this problem for those who need a visual aid and a side for "hints". I have been trying to solve this question with limited success.

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You can directly follow the hint

$$\lim_{x \to -2}3x^2+ax+a+3=0$$
 
I realize that, but I don't understand the hints leading up to that point. Can you explain or elaborate? Like the (3x + k).
 
Let us look at an easier example

$$\lim_{x \to 2}\frac{x^2-a}{x-2}$$

So , what should be the value of $a$ so that the limit exists and why ?
 
(x-2), right?
 
Rido12 said:
I realize that, but I don't understand the hints leading up to that point. Can you explain or elaborate? Like the (3x + k).
Hint #1: It is easy to see that the denominator factors as $(x-1)(x+2)$. Since the limit goes to $x=-2$, we must get rid of the $(x+2)$ term in the denominator. To do this, the numerator also has to factor with an $(x+2)$ term.

Hint #2: The leading coefficient of the numerator is 3, and one of its factors ($(x+2)$) has a leading coefficient of 1, so the other factor has a leading coefficient of 3, so it is in the form $(3x+k)$, for some constant k.

Hint #4: Expanding $(x+2)(3x+k)$ gives $3x^2+(6+k)x+2k$, which in turn gives $6+k=a$ and $2k=a+3$. Using this, it is easy to solve for a and k, which will give the factors of the numerator.

- - - Updated - - -

Rido12 said:
(x-2), right?
Actually, I'm pretty sure he meant a constant term, so no. Try to find an $a$ such that the numerator contains an $(x-2)$ term.
 
eddybob123 said:
Hint #2: The leading coefficient of the numerator is 3, and one of its factors ($(x+2)$) has a leading coefficient of 1, so the other factor has a leading coefficient of 3, so it is in the form $(3x+k)$, for some constant k.
- - - Updated - - -Actually, I'm pretty sure he meant a constant term, so no. Try to find an $a$ such that the numerator contains an $(x-2)$ term.

The problem lies on Hint two; I lost you there D:
eddybob123 said:
Actually, I'm pretty sure he meant a constant term, so no. Try to find an $a$ such that the numerator contains an $(x-2)$ term.
Then a could be 4?
 
Last edited:
Rido12 said:
The problem lies on Hint two; I lost you there D:
We want the numerator to factor as $3x^2+ax+a+3=(x+2)(mx+k)$ for some coefficients m and k. Expanding this gives $3x^2+ax+a+3=mx^2+kx+2mx+2k$. Therefore, $m=3$ and restrictions to $a$ can be made.

- - - Updated - - -

Rido12 said:
Then a could be 4?
Yes, it is. The numerator can factor as $$(x+2)(x-2)$$

*Edit* Actually, you don't even need to find restrictions to a. You can solve for it directly using Hint #4.
 
eddybob123 said:
We want the numerator to factor as $3x^2+ax+a+3=(x+2)(mx+k)$ for some coefficients m and k. Expanding this gives $3x^2+ax+a+3=mx^2+kx+2mx+2k$. Therefore, $m=3$ and restrictions to $a$ can be made.

- - - Updated - - -Yes, it is. The numerator can factor as $$(x+2)(x-2)$$

*Edit* Actually, you don't even need to find restrictions to a. You can solve for it directly using Hint #4.

Thanks, I get it now, but, what led you choose "(mx+k)"? Could you not just have done (x+2)(x+k)?

EDIT: Oh, could "m" be representing any arbitrary number?
 
  • #10
Rido12 said:
Thanks, I get it now, but, what led you choose "(mx+k)"? Could you not just have done (x+2)(x+k)?
Expanding $(x+2)(x+k)$ gives $x^2+(k+2)x+2k$, where the polynomial we want is actually $3x^2+ax+a+3$. Note that the coefficient of $x^2$ in the cases are different. If we want the equality to be satisfied for all x, we want the coefficients to be the same.

- - - Updated - - -

Rido12 said:
Oh, could "m" be representing any arbitrary number?
It is a variable which we solved for.
 
  • #11
eddybob123 said:
Expanding $(x+2)(x+k)$ gives $x^2+(k+2)x+2k$, where the polynomial we want is actually $3x^2+ax+a+3$. Note that the coefficient of $x^2$ in the cases are different. If we want the equality to be satisfied for all x, we want the coefficients to be the same.

- - - Updated - - -It is a variable which we solved for.

If I wanted it in the form $3x^2+ax+a+3$, and I had to multiple (something)(x+2) to obtain it in that form, it wasn't intuitive for me to multiple that by "(mx+K)". It works out, but I wouldn't have came up with that immediately ... so would I have to use like trial and error to do so, or is there some sort of principle?
 
  • #12
Rido12 said:
It works out, but I wouldn't have came up with that immediately ... so would I have to use like trial and error to do so, or is there some sort of principle?
What's wrong with $$(mx+k)$$?
 
  • #13
eddybob123 said:
What's wrong with $$(mx+k)$$?

Nothing, it's just that I wouldn't have come up with that straight off the bat. If I needed it in the form 3x2+ax+a+3, multiplying (x-2) by "mx+k" wouldn't have been apparent. How were you able to determine so quickly that "mx+k" was the ideal candidate?
 
  • #14
Rido12 said:
How were you able to determine so quickly that "mx+k" was the ideal candidate?
The polynomial you were trying to factor was of degree 2, so there are two factors of degree 1, that is, of the form $(ax+b)(cx+d)$.
 
  • #15
eddybob123 said:
The polynomial you were trying to factor was of degree 2, so there are two factors of degree 1, that is, of the form $(ax+b)(cx+d)$.

Thank you!
 

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