Is this the correct representation for showing the direction of a star on CMD?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter hraghav
  • Start date Start date
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the representation of a star's movement on the Colour-Magnitude Diagram (CMD) in the context of extinction effects, specifically for a given extinction value (Av = 1.0). Participants explore how extinction influences both the color and magnitude of stars, and how to accurately depict this movement on the CMD.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related, Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the red arrow indicating the star's direction on the CMD is correct for Av = 1.0 and seeks additional considerations for similar problems.
  • Another participant discusses the need for the dust law (R_V) to determine the slope and suggests using a local R_V value of approximately 3.
  • A participant inquires about the initial and final coordinates for B-V and m_V, expressing uncertainty about how to determine the final position without knowing the intrinsic color (B-V)not.
  • Some participants explain that the star's position on the CMD shifts due to reddening and dimming effects, represented by a vector (Δcolor, Δmagnitude).
  • One participant asserts that the arrow marking the star's location is appropriate, as the star moves upwards (dimmer) and to the right (redder) on the CMD.
  • A later reply highlights the complexity of the magnitude scale, noting that dimmer stars correspond to larger m_V values and cautioning against confusion due to the inverted scales used in astronomy.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of certainty regarding the correct representation of the star's movement on the CMD. While some agree on the general direction of movement, there is no consensus on specific coordinates or the implications of the dust law.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the need for clarity regarding the intrinsic properties of the star and the effects of extinction, but do not resolve the uncertainties related to the final coordinates or the specific values of B-V and m_V.

hraghav
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Homework Statement: Effects of extinction in the Colour- Magnitude Diagram (CMD) of NGC 5139;
Since extinction affects the position of a star on both the x-axis and y-axis, then draw an arrow that shows the direction a star moves on the CMD for Av = 1.0
Relevant Equations: No equations are needed for this

IMG-20241201-WA0000.jpg

Is the red arrow marking the star's direction correctly for Av = 1 magnitude? Im a little confused with this, also is there any other points we could keep in mind while doing such problems?
Thank you
 
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= (reddening, dimming)
= (##\Delta(B-V)##, ##\Delta m_V##)
= (##A_V/R_V##, ##A_V##)
= (##1/R_V##, ##1##)

If you want the slope you need the dust law ##R_V##
You can use a local R_V ~ 3
 
ergospherical said:
= (reddening, dimming)
= (##\Delta(B-V)##, ##\Delta m_V##)
= (##A_V/R_V##, ##A_V##)
= (##1/R_V##, ##1##)

If you want the slope you need the dust law ##R_V##
You can use a local R_V ~ 3
What would the coordinates be for the initial and final positions of B-V and mv?
I know that initial position of B-V is 0.333 but how would I find its final position since I do not know what (B-V)not is. Also as -1 is not on the scale of mv how would I choose the coordinates for mv?
 
The start coordinates whatever are the intrinsic color and magnitude of the star. When we see the star from Earth, we get reddening and dimming effects due to the dust. The position of the star on the CMD appears to shift by the vector (##\Delta##color, ##\Delta##magnitude).
 
ergospherical said:
The start coordinates whatever are the intrinsic color and magnitude of the star. When we see the star from Earth, we get reddening and dimming effects due to the dust. The position of the star on the CMD appears to shift by the vector (##\Delta##color, ##\Delta##magnitude).
So my arrow marking location would be an appropriate representation of the direction since the star does travel upwards as it gets dimmer and towards the right as it gets redder?
 
An oddity of astronomy is that dimmer ==> larger m_V.
It's because m_V := C - 2.5 log (F),
(F being observed flux)

So you need to be careful to figure out which way the star goes. It doesn't help that astronomers like to write the scales upside down either
 

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