Just a little respect for the President

[Char. Limit]

they're not so different that I don't respect where you stand.

This line just increased my respect for you by about 100x. I completely agree here, and I wish more people would think this way.

 

[mheslep]

[...]We stopped at Andrews Airforce base to shop at the BX and eat. I use the bathroom at the BX and someone wrote "Obama's a Liar'.

I am not a fan of Obama, but at a military base? He is still the commander-in-chief, I don't buy that "Hes not my President" b/s that the angry people always say.

I just don't get it. Yeah it is politics, but there is a time and place.

[...] and I like and respect enough of those people that I would never be a coward and write graffiti about him.[...]

[...] but I do NOT respect Bush W. ... who's legacy is the death of foreign (to me) civilians, and American (and coalition) soldiers for a lie in Iraq. Forget the economic devastation, in a better world he would have been impeached and hanged along with his cabinet.
[...]
.. some people are not respectable, they're idiots or criminals and bring literally nothing to the table. We've had a very few, but to pretend that they deserve the respect a functional president who was elected honestly does, is to me, a kind of disrespect for the office all on its own. [...]

[highlights mine] Well there you go Airborne - the same kind of rationalization that no doubt resulted in the bathroom wall scrawl. If you want to persuade people to do otherwise here is your chance.

 

[nismaratwork]

[highlights mine] Well there you go Airborne - the same kind of rationalization that no doubt resulted in the bathroom wall scrawl. If you want to persuade people to do otherwise here is your chance.

Let me get this straight, you're saying that because I indulged in what I have called hyperbole in a previous post, you think I would sink to bathroom-graffiti?!

I'll be clear: I'd happily tell 2 former presidents to go to hell (W. and Carter) to their faces, and admit to that here or to anyone in a face-to-face discussion. I am NOT going to disseminate my personal view of the men via bathroom stall, internet blog, or even a protest. Hell, part of my anger is the shame that W. brought to the office during his presidency, and the shame Carter is (not to ignore many good things he's been involved in) AFTER his time in office. I've stated clearly that respect for the office of the president is important to some for symbolic reasons, but is important to ALL for practical reasons, especially in a military setting. I would appreciate it if you don't cherrypick less than a handful of what I've said, ignoring in one case (the bolded one) what I said:

ow, I should be clear, the "hanging" bit was hyperbole... actually so was the impeachment part. I just hate the guy and have no respect for him.. just want to make that clear. I understood what you were saying to be a matter of principle, and one which I have a different take on. I don't see that both of us can't stand on our own principle without a pyrophoric reaction... they're not so different that I don't respect where you stand.

I thought that was quite clear. It's one thing to not respect someone, and another to be libelous or slanderous. For instance, I don't say, "Bush W. wanted oil so he started a war", not in the least because I don't believe it and no proof exists. I don't say that I think Carter is an anti-Semite, just that I violently disagree with his views on Israel. Do you grasp the difference? I could say that I think Obama is an ineffective president, but just the comment "he lies", is pure disrespect. I can't tell if you haven't followed the conversation, or if you're trying to make a point for the hell of it. I've read many of your posts, so I know that failing to grasp something is unlikely, and thus I'm inclined to be insulted by your characterization of my views.

 

[mheslep]

Let me get this straight, you're saying that because I indulged in what I have called hyperbole in a previous post, you think I would sink to bathroom-graffiti?!

I'll be clear: I'd happily tell 2 former presidents to go to hell (W. and Carter) to their faces, and admit to that here or to anyone in a face-to-face discussion. I am NOT going to disseminate my personal view of the men via bathroom stall.

What's the difference? As you know, you don't have the opportunity to talk to either face to face, and this internet discussion board is likewise anonymous, essentially writing on a wall. In any case your answer to the OP's call for respect for a President in general (not Obama, Bush, whoever) is clear: no.

 

[mheslep]

Let me get this straight, you're saying that because I indulged in what I have called hyperbole in a previous post,

Ok, so if the original bathroom "Obama lies" poet to which the OP referred had come back and post scripted, "the above is hyperbole", then no harm done?

 

[nismaratwork]

What's the difference? As you know, you don't have the opportunity to talk to either face to face, and this internet discussion board is likewise anonymous, essentially writing on a wall. In any case your answer to the OP's call for respect for a President in general (not Obama, Bush, whoever) is clear: no.

Many people meet current and former presidents in person... hell, the audience of The Daily Show was within shouting distance of Carter and Clinton within a week. I don't think shouting, "go to hell" is such a stretch in that situation, especially if a member of congress can shout, "you lie!" during a presidential SPEECH. Yeah, you're going to get moved out of the set, but it's hardly going to stop them.

You don't have to take me at my word that I'm not the bathroom graffiti type, or prone to libel/slander. The fact is that you're taking 4 or 5 sentences out of a long discussion and at the end of it, setting me up as your personal target. So... < >. See? Very easy, and I could be sanctioned for saying that on PF, anonymous or not, although I'm just trying to make a point...

I would add, that given my absolute hatred of Bush W. simply wanting to tell him to go to hell IS respectful compared to the depth of feeling I have regarding the man. If he were just a manager of a company I worked for, and had a similar effect on that company as I believe Bush did on the country, I'd be more inclined to say or do more. The fact is that I DO believe as a rule there should be a standard of respect for POTUS, but there are naturally exceptions to every rule.

 

[nismaratwork]

Ok, so if the original bathroom "Obama lies" poet to which the OP referred had come back and post scripted, "the above is hyperbole", then no harm done?

That's more logical fallacy than actual question mheslep, because I'm accountable within the PF community for what I say... bathroom graffiti is TRULY anonymous.

 

[ThomasT]

In any case I believe the topic of the discussion is supposed to be about showing Respect for our President, which we should have (and show) regardless if we are in the military or a civilian. We should respect Obama, just as we would have respected any other president that is elected into office. That said there is also unnecessarily slanderous remarks about George Bush. Regardless if we like him. Regardless if we agree with him. We should still respect him. He was our President, our leader, not common garbage like how some refer to him as. The bathroom message was unnecessary and condemnable.

Hi Dennis, I agree with you about the bathroom message. I disagree with you about respecting public officials who we know have broken the public covenant. Bush should be spending the rest of his life in prison. I'm ok with hanging him also.

Regarding public officials in general, remember that our first duty as citizens of this republic is to mistrust our elected officials. If we fail to use the tools that the founding fathers have given us, like impeachment, because we think, mistakenly, that using these tools is evidence that our system isn't working, then our system isn't working.