Lowest possible altitude for a Satellite

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the lowest possible altitude for a satellite to maintain an orbit around the Earth. Participants explore various factors influencing orbital stability, including atmospheric drag, fuel requirements for boosting, and the implications of different altitudes on satellite operations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that satellites in Low Earth Orbit (LEO) experience atmospheric drag, which necessitates periodic boosting to maintain altitude.
  • There is a discussion about the practical limits of how low a satellite can orbit before it requires continuous boosting, with some suggesting that this threshold is around 140 km based on Tiangong-1 data.
  • Participants debate the definition of "orbiting" when continuous boosting is required, questioning whether such a scenario still qualifies as an orbit.
  • One participant suggests that the ISS requires monthly boosting, raising questions about what constitutes "extremely low" or "very little" boosting.
  • Another participant proposes that the lowest possible altitude could theoretically be just above sea level, contingent on achieving escape velocity and having sufficient thrust to counteract drag.
  • There are mentions of the variability in drag based on satellite orientation and solar activity, which complicates the determination of a stable altitude.
  • Some participants express frustration over the lack of precise answers and the vagueness of the original question regarding boosting requirements.
  • One participant references the use of ion thrusters at an altitude of 235 km as a relevant example.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the exact lowest altitude for a satellite to orbit. Multiple competing views are presented regarding the implications of atmospheric drag, boosting requirements, and the definitions of stable orbits.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in providing a definitive answer due to varying conditions such as satellite design, orientation, and atmospheric effects, which influence drag and fuel requirements.

  • #31
The top of the stratopause (60 km below the 50th parallel or so) has an atmospheric pressure of 7 x 10E-11. This is most assuredly enough drag to decay an orbit rapidly. But the major problem doesn't come from the density of the atmosphere but because an orbit this low requires a rather large velocity forcing the satellite to generate a great deal of drag from hitting a lot of molecules at this speed. What is it? - v = sqrt /Gravity x mass of satellite / actual radius of orbit.

So in truth we do have satellites as low as 100 miles but with the capacity to boost you CAN retain a LEO as low as the stratopause. The latest NASA weather satellite GOES has the capacity to boost its orbit but it has an elliptical orbit with a low of about 8,000 km putting it into the area of medium Earth orbit.

The normal definition of a low Earth orbit is anything below 3,000 km.

Presently SpaceX is planning on planting thousands of satellites into LEO around 1,200 km for more rapid world wide Internet access.

I have been unable to find the latest suggestions for very low Earth orbit weather satellites that would require constant renewal since they would be falling out of the sky almost like rain.
 
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  • #32
Tom Kunich said:
v = sqrt /Gravity x mass of satellite / actual radius of orbit
The mass of the satellite does not enter in (*). One can obtain the orbital velocity by equating the centripetal acceleration for a circular orbit ##a=\frac{v^2}{r}## with the centripetal acceleration provided by gravity ##a=\frac{GM}{r^2}##.
$$\frac{v^2}{r} = \frac{GM}{r^2}$$
$$v^2 = \frac{GM}{r}$$
$$v = \sqrt{\frac{GM}{r}}$$
The M in the numerator is the mass of the primary (e.g. the mass of the Earth), not the mass of the satellite.

For an orbit at an altitude of less than a few hundred km, the orbital radius will be approximately equal to the radius of the Earth and the orbital velocity will be approximately independent of altitude. About 8 kilometers per second. [Rule of thumb: orbital velocity = escape velocity divided by the square root of two]

(*) The mass of the satellite is irrelevant unless the satellite has significant mass compared to the primary. Then one has to consider that both primary and satellite are orbiting their combined center of mass.
 
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  • #33
Thanks, that was from memory and I probably was think it had to do with the moon's mass. A little difficult to concentrate when you're about to go to the dentist. And since my waiting 9 months for an implant to heal which just extremely painfully pulled out, at the moment it's even more difficult to concentrate.
 

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