Magnets in space -- AKA vacuum

[russ_watters]

The Buoyant force or lack of it.

Buoyancy is an upwards force: it acts parallel to the refrigerator door and would only serve to reduce the apparent weight of the magnet by an imperceptible amount. It doesn't affect the force between the fridge and magnet.

The cause is that the object (magnet) is surrounded by air which has mass.
If one side or more or part of the object is not surrounded then the object does not experience the same upwards thrust or buoyancy from the air and in effect it has the accumulated weight of the column air above it pressing down on it.

That's the suction-cup effect, not buoyancy. Suction cups work because the pressure of the air trapped under them is lower than the pressure of the air outside of them. And because they form a tight seal, pulling on them just increases the force holding them to the surface they are attached to. The effect can still be noticeable even for objects not tightly sealed to what they are resting on, such as when you pick a large board or poster off the floor and feel the resistance break as air rushes under it.

I don't think this effect could be noticeable with a refrigerator magnet.

 

[Buckleymanor]

Same for everything else that is not the magnetic force.

The buoyancy of a magnet is absolutely negligible. it is also completely independent of its magnetic properties - it modifies the perceived weight from gravity. This changes if you go far away from Earth, of course - by 100%, not just by the ~0.1% the buoyancy provides on Earth.

There we would be at the suction cup that got mentioned earlier. This has nothing to do with either buoyancy or magnetic forces now. You keep mixing different concepts.

So you stick by your statement that "Your fridge magnet is much smaller, but it has a stronger field. It will work in vacuum and in space in the same way it works on Earth".
That there will be no difference in all cases of fridge magnets and fridges as to the amount of force needed to remove the magnet from the fridge.
When considering magnetic force it is necessary to ignore all other forces that may be acting on the magnetic object in different enviroments if you want to be objective!

 

[Buckleymanor]

Buoyancy is an upwards force: it acts parallel to the refrigerator door and would only serve to reduce the apparent weight of the magnet by an imperceptible amount. It doesn't affect the force between the fridge and magnet.

That's the suction-cup effect, not buoyancy. Suction cups work because the pressure of the air trapped under them is lower than the pressure of the air outside of them. And because they form a tight seal, pulling on them just increases the force holding them to the surface they are attached to. The effect can still be noticeable even for objects not tightly sealed to what they are resting on, such as when you pick a large board or poster off the floor and feel the resistance break as air rushes under it.

I don't think this effect could be noticeable with a refrigerator magnet.

Go and try it my fridge magnets do appear to have this property.The flexible ones seem to be designed with this in mind.They stick more.

 

[russ_watters]

Go and try it my fridge magnets do appear to have this property.The flexible ones seem to be designed with this in mind.They stick more.

I think you're mistaking the magnetism itself for the suction-cup effect. Try this: take a magnet and try prying it off a hard, non-magnetic surface. I just did, with a 3"x3" flexible magnet: nothing.

 

[DEMOCRATIS369]

They found a particle called Higgs-boson (named after Peter Higgs).

I don't know where you got that nonsense about Stephen Hawking from, I'm sure he never said that.

He actually have made a bet with one of the Scientist workingon the Cern project. He actually bet one dollar that it didn't exist, he said that if it was found Human kind would find a way to use it for nefarious uses.A. K.A God particle.

 

[mfb]

So you stick by your statement that "Your fridge magnet is much smaller, but it has a stronger field. It will work in vacuum and in space in the same way it works on Earth".

That is correct.

That there will be no difference in all cases of fridge magnets and fridges as to the amount of force needed to remove the magnet from the fridge.

I never said that, although it is a good approximation for most fridge magnets.

When considering magnetic force it is necessary to ignore all other forces that may be acting on the magnetic object in different enviroments if you want to be objective!

Then can we please do this? Neglect all the non-magnetic forces? You keep adding them over and over again here.

He actually have made a bet with one of the Scientist workingon the Cern project. He actually bet one dollar that it didn't exist

That's not the same as the claim 'said that they would never find the"GOD PARTICLE" '.

he said that if it was found Human kind would find a way to use it for nefarious uses.A. K.A God particle.

Source? And even if he said that (I doubt that he said exactly that), it does not imply what you claimed earlier: "it will be a short matter of time that we realize it was meant to never be found"

This is a physics forum, please don't misrepresent statements made by others.

And please stop calling it "god particle". This name is just nonsense and not used in physics.

 

[DEMOCRATIS369]

That is correct.
I never said that, although it is a good approximation for most fridge magnets.
Then can we please do this? Neglect all the non-magnetic forces? You keep adding them over and over again here.

That's not the same as the claim 'said that they would never find the"GOD PARTICLE" '.
Source? And even if he said that (I doubt that he said exactly that), it does not imply what you claimed earlier: "it will be a short matter of time that we realize it was meant to never be found"

This is a physics forum, please don't misrepresent statements made by others.

And please stop calling it "god particle". This name is just nonsense and not used in physics.

I apologize. I was only using that term in the context the Mr. Hawkins did, Mr. Hawkins said "the god particle will probably never be found".Please excuse me sir I am still learning the rules of the forum. Mr. Hawkins called the particle that name tongue in cheek, I apologize for my ignorance sir, I am still learning the rules. I also understand that is no excuse. From now on I will think before I type.

 

[jbriggs444]

I apologize. I was only using that term in the context the Mr. Hawkins did, Mr. Hawkins said "the god particle will probably never be found".Please excuse me sir I am still learning the rules of the forum. Mr. Hawkins called the particle that name tongue in cheek, I apologize for my ignorance sir, I am still learning the rules. I also understand that is no excuse. From now on I will think before I type.

[Emphasis added].

It is Hawking. Stephen Hawking. Not "Mr. Hawkins". In any case neither Stephen Hawking nor the Higgs boson are on topic in this thread. They have nothing to do with magnets in a vacuum.

 

[DEMOCRATIS369]

[Emphasis added].

It is Hawking. Stephen Hawking. Not "Mr. Hawkins". In any case neither Stephen Hawking nor the Higgs boson are on topic in this thread. They have nothing to do with magnets in a vacuum.

Enough let it go! That thread was over four days ago, I have heard from every want to be Einstein in the community. I only came to this forum to learn, I am 11years old and fascinated with physics. But if all physicists are as jaded as the ones constantly correcting me about a thread that I haven't been responding to in days. I thought this was a place where I could ask questions as well as learn. Not constantly be corrected by people who treat me like the kids at School who constantly torment me for being different. All I have to say is when I am a physicist and a kid want's to ask me a question no matter how ignorant it may be I will never treat anyone the way this community has treated me.

 

[Nugatory]

Time to close this thread, I think.