Meaning of the Energy-Time Uncertainty Relation

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the meaning and implications of the energy-time uncertainty relation in quantum mechanics. Participants explore its interpretation, significance, and comparisons to other uncertainty relations, particularly the position-momentum uncertainty relation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks clarification on whether the energy-time uncertainty relation implies that increased accuracy in measuring energy leads to decreased accuracy in determining the duration of energy states or the measurement time itself.
  • Another participant explains that the relation sets a minimum value for the product of the uncertainty in energy and the typical time interval over which a system's state changes, citing atomic energy levels as an example.
  • A different participant expresses confusion regarding the fundamental nature of the time-energy uncertainty relation compared to the position-momentum relation, noting that it cannot be derived as easily and suggesting that it may be violated in certain systems.
  • There is mention of a specific paper by Aharonov and Bohm that discusses potential violations of the time-energy uncertainty relation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a mix of understanding and confusion regarding the time-energy uncertainty relation, with some agreeing on its implications while others question its fundamental status and potential exceptions.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the difficulty in defining the "typical time interval" for changes in a system's state, indicating a dependence on the observable in question and its uncertainty. There are also references to specific literature that may provide further insights.

MrRobotoToo
Messages
110
Reaction score
50
I'd like to know what exactly it's telling us. Does it mean that the more accurately we measure the energy of a system the less accurately we know for how long the system has been in that range of energies? Or does it mean that the more accurately energy is measured the less accurately we know how long the measurement took? Or something else entirely? Some clarification will be much appreciated.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The time-energy uncertainty relation gives a minimum value for the product of two numbers:

1) the uncertainty in the energy of a system
2) the typical time interval over which the state of the system changes appreciably

So systems with sharply defined energy change only slowly. Conversely fast-changing systems have poorly defined energies. Perhaps the best example is atomic energy levels. Electrons in excited states will decay back to the ground state by emitting a photon after some typical lifetime. As a result the excited energy levels of an atom have slightly uncertain energies, with uncertainty inversely proportional to the lifetime. This is observed as a slight broadening of spectral lines, because photons from this transition can actually be emitted with a range of energies instead of one sharply defined energy (note that there are also other effects that broaden spectral lines).

How do we define "the typical time interval over which the state of the system changes appreciably?" It's something like this. Pick any observable X. X has some expectation value and some uncertainty. The time interval of interest is the time it takes for X's expectation value to change by more than its uncertainty.

I think that Griffiths, for one, has a somewhat careful discussion of the time-energy uncertainty relation.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Joker93
Thanks, The_Duck. That was quite useful.
 
I myself am still somewhat puzzled with the time-energy uncertainty relation. It doesn't seem as fundamental as, for example, the position-momentum relation, because it cannot be derived as straightforwardly. Moreover, there have been claims that for some systems the time-energy uncertainty relation can be violated*. As posted by The_Duck, the correct way to think about the time-energy uncertainty relation seems to be in terms of the lifetime of the system, not as the inability to measure its energy with infinite accuracy in a finite time.

*Aharonov and Bohm, “Time in quantum theory and the uncertainty relation for time and energy,” Phys. Rev. 122, 1649 (1961).

http://journals.aps.org/pr/abstract/10.1103/PhysRev.122.1649
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K