Motion vs Time: Does Time Affect Motion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between motion and time, specifically whether motion affects time or vice versa. Participants explore concepts related to spacetime, relativity, and the implications of various interpretations of motion and time, without delving into mathematical explanations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that motion affects time, while others challenge this view, suggesting that the relationship is not one of causation.
  • There is a reference to Einstein's postulates and the successful experimental implications of relativity, with some arguing that these concepts are often misunderstood.
  • One participant emphasizes that the equation velocity = distance/time does not imply a cause-and-effect relationship, but merely states an equality.
  • Another participant questions the statement that "time only occurs when energy is matter," suggesting it lacks coherence and clarity.
  • Some responses indicate that the discussion includes misunderstandings of special relativity, particularly regarding time dilation.
  • Recommendations for further reading, such as Taylor and Wheeler's "Spacetime Physics," are made in response to perceived misconceptions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the relationship between motion and time, with no consensus reached on the matter. Disagreements persist about the interpretations and implications of various statements made throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the vagueness of certain claims and the need for clearer definitions. There are unresolved interpretations of statements regarding time, energy, and motion, which contribute to the ongoing debate.

Fernando Freire
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Why Space/TIME? I feel Motion affects Time, not the contrary. Thanks for claritication (no Math please).
 
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Fernando Freire said:
Why Space/TIME?

This question is much too vague to answer.

Fernando Freire said:
I feel Motion affects Time, not the contrary.

I don't understand what you mean by this.
 
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Fernando Freire said:
Why Space/TIME?
It's just spacetime, or space-time if you prefer. Because space and time being parts of a united whole is an interpretation of the mathematics following from Einstein's postulates. Further testable implications of the postulates have been thoroughly tested and match experiment every time.
Fernando Freire said:
I feel Motion affects Time, not the contrary.
Feel whatever you like. Science deals in assumptions (as few as possible), the logical implications thereof, and whether or not those implications match experiment. Relativity is outstandingly successful in that regard.
 
PeterDonis said:
This question is much too vague to answer.
I don't understand what you mean by this.
Thank you. Sorry.
 
Fernando Freire said:
Why Space/TIME? I feel Motion affects Time, not the contrary. Thanks for claritication (no Math please).
Neglecting the completely irrelevant feeling, the equation velocity=distance/time does not imply any cause and effect relationship whatsoever. It says only that they are equal, not that one caused the other.

That said, I think it is pretty obvious that motion does not cause time, but it seems to be an idea that has a lot of appeal to some people for reasons that I don’t understand.
 
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Dale said:
Neglecting the completely irrelevant feeling, the equation velocity=distance/time does not imply any cause and effect relationship whatsoever. It says only that they are equal, not that one caused the other.

That said, I think it is pretty obvious that motion does not cause time, but it seems to be an idea that has a lot of appeal to some people for reasons that I don’t understand.

Correct me if I am wrong: Time only occurs when Energy is Matter. And motion seems to affect it since it stops at C as far as I know.
 
Fernando Freire said:
Time only occurs when Energy is Matter.

This does not make any sense. Sorry, but if you think that that's in the box, then you are simply wrong.

In physics time is what a clock measures. Energy is a property of matter and there are many other properties that are important. Start with that.
 
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Fernando Freire said:
Correct me if I am wrong: Time only occurs when Energy is Matter. And motion seems to affect it since it stops at C as far as I know.
This isn't even wrong. It's just words flung together without regard to their meaning. The only place to start on correcting it is from the beginning - I recommend Taylor and Wheeler's Spacetime Physics.
 
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Fernando Freire said:
Time only occurs when Energy is Matter.
What experiment could you perform to determine if this is correct?
 
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Ibix said:
This isn't even wrong. It's just words flung together without regard to their meaning.
The first part, yes -- the second part is just the typical first-reaction misunderstanding of SR time dilation.
 
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  • #11
russ_watters said:
the second part is just the typical first-reaction misunderstanding of SR time dilation.
Maybe. Depends on whether you read the second "it" as meaning time (in which case the sentence is wrong) or motion (in which case it's word salad). Your interpretation is more sympathetic and probably makes more sense grammatically - in which case the first sentence is not even wrong and the second sentence is just wrong. Taylor and Wheeler remains my recommendation.
 
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